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Should College be Free?


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#1 Kaddict

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 04:56 PM

What do you guys think about this? What caveats would be included? 



#2 Frizzle

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 05:06 PM

Yes. An educated population is only a good thing. But that's socialism so not available in the US.

#3 SheOfTheEnderworld

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 05:06 PM

What do you guys think about this? What caveats would be included? 

 

Firstly, how would you make this economically sustainable to begin with?



#4 Swar

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 05:11 PM

Definitely. Everyone should have a chance to go to college, no matter how poor they are. Our free colleges used to be really good. They still are excellent, I'm trying for them, but unfortunately a lot of them are being abandoned by the government.



#5 Kass

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 05:17 PM

This reminded me of something I remember seeing in my government class that I thought was pretty interesting.

 

In the Arizona Constitution (Article 11, Section 6) it says: "The university and all other state educational institutions shall be open to students of both sexes, and the instruction furnished shall be as nearly free as possible."

 

I don't know what happened, but college is expensive nowadays... 



#6 HiMyNameIsNick

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 05:28 PM

Both education and health-care / medical services MUST be free.


Edited by HiMyNameIsNick, 12 November 2015 - 05:29 PM.


#7 ortin

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 06:55 PM

Firstly, how would you make this economically sustainable to begin with?

More taxes duh. Depends on where the tax is placed though, that makes the difference. It could come from closing corporate loopholes and actually fully taxing corporations, increasing the tax on the rich, increasing the tax on everyone, increasing the tax on the middle/low class (why???), or increasing taxes on a specific industry. Lots of ways to do it!



#8 Lollita

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:01 PM

Both education and health-care / medical services MUST be free.

 

Yes. We have both for free here, not perfect, but all free.

 

Definitely. Everyone should have a chance to go to college, no matter how poor they are. Our free colleges used to be really good. They still are excellent, I'm trying for them, but unfortunately a lot of them are being abandoned by the government.

 

Yes, at least in my state the public college is better than any private one. I'm from Paraná btw haha



#9 Romy

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:02 PM

More taxes duh. Depends on where the tax is placed though, that makes the difference. It could come from closing corporate loopholes and actually fully taxing corporations, increasing the tax on the rich, increasing the tax on everyone, increasing the tax on the middle/low class (why???), or increasing taxes on a specific industry. Lots of ways to do it!

But Reaganomics! Don't you know that by taxing the rich we make them less willing to give jobs to people? Don't you know anything about trickle down economics?

 

Jeez Nitro. So naive.



#10 Swar

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:04 PM

Yes, at least in my state the public college is better than any private one. I'm from Paraná btw haha

Of course it had to be from the South :p

 

We have 4 in Rio, I think. The most famous one, UFRJ, is looking really bad :/ They're completely neglecting the place.



#11 Amarillo

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:05 PM

Both education and health-care / medical services MUST be free.

 

we have Education and health care for free :) 



#12 Lollita

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:09 PM

Of course it had to be from the South :p

 

We have 4 in Rio, I think. The most famous one, UFRJ, is looking really bad :/ They're completely neglecting the place.

 

Yeah, I heard that some private colleges in SP and in Rio are better then public. I don't know if that's a possible reason, but we only have one here, the UFPR.



#13 Swar

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:12 PM

Yeah, I heard that some private colleges in SP and in Rio are better then public. I don't know if that's a possible reason, but we only have one here, the UFPR.

They're super expensive, though. Especially medicine. UERJ and UFF are still pretty good.



#14 Lollita

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 07:30 PM

They're super expensive, though. Especially medicine. UERJ and UFF are still pretty good.

 

Yes, medicine all around the country is so expensive, It is a shame really  :agree: And in those for free, its really hard. Some people spend years and years trying to get in.


Edited by LollitaM, 12 November 2015 - 07:36 PM.


#15 Kaddict

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 08:52 PM

My undergrad college offered a scholarship (with money from tobacco company settlements) to all people who graduated from our state and attended college in our state. When it was implemented, the only requirement (other than residency) was a 2.0 GPA. It made it essentially free to attend college for in-state-ers. This caused the graduation rate to PLUMMET because people wouldn't really lose anything by failing their classes, since they hadn't invested anything into it (other than their time, which they clearly hadn't invested because they wouldn't go to class). I think there should be very cheap options (or grants more widely available to people of low SES) but I think that having something for free makes people take it for granted more. Also, it is not feasible to have it free all around. I am sure everyone (in the states) has seen that clip floating around facebook of the Fox news guy telling off the leader of the millionstudentmarch thingy that even if they taxed they 1%ers at 100%, it wouldn't cover the cost of tuition.



#16 savethekings

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 08:57 PM

I don't think that a college education benefits everyone necessarily. I think that trade schools are much better than college for most people. I also feel like there are already free options to increase your education (if that is your goal) like the Khan Academy. I don't think college should be free. There are dirt cheap options and government grants available for people, so money isn't an excuse to not go if it is a big enough priority for you.



#17 Swar

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:07 PM

Here you basically have to study 24/7 every day to get in, because it's so many people trying to get in, and in the end it's really hard to see someone take it for granted. Usually the ones in private college take it for granted, mostly because their parents are the ones paying. Of course it's hard to compare to the US, because our education system is completely different.

 

One thing I don't like is the selection process. We have an exam every year, which you can use your score to try for 2 free college options (you can change them while the registration period is open). The exam is the same for the whole country, so the questions have to be in a way that everyone would be able to do, but this is a huge country. That's impossible. It's extremely tiring, two days with 90 questions in each day, and you only have that chance through the whole year. And there's a lot of luck involved in it too. I think your grades from middle/high school shoud matter too.



#18 ortin

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:11 PM

But Reaganomics! Don't you know that by taxing the rich we make them less willing to give jobs to people? Don't you know anything about trickle down economics?

 

Jeez Nitro. So naive.

Lol trickle down economics



#19 Ehentalix

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:18 PM

College, and all higher education, should absolutely be free, or at least heavily subsidized. There is no reason that students should have to go hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt just to be able to get a degree, or even tens of thousands. As it stands, government grants and loans don't always cover everything, and working a minimum wage job in the USA sure as Hell doesn't. And that's assuming you get anything at all, since it's incredibly easy to be passed over for these sorts of things.

 

As for things like Khan Academy, good luck getting your certification recognized by potential employers. Hell, there are actual real colleges that are brushed off when they pop up on resumes.



#20 ortin

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:27 PM

I don't think that a college education benefits everyone necessarily. I think that trade schools are much better than college for most people. I also feel like there are already free options to increase your education (if that is your goal) like the Khan Academy.

Most people's main reason of going to college is to get a training on their future career, and Khan Academy isn't going to cut it most of the time. 



#21 Keil

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:43 PM

No because I paid for most of my college experience and I don't want newer generations to miss out the excruciating experience of buying cool stuff instead of food.



#22 Kaddict

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:44 PM

College, and all higher education, should absolutely be free, or at least heavily subsidized. There is no reason that students should have to go hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt just to be able to get a degree, or even tens of thousands. As it stands, government grants and loans don't always cover everything, and working a minimum wage job in the USA sure as Hell doesn't. And that's assuming you get anything at all, since it's incredibly easy to be passed over for these sorts of things.

 

As for things like Khan Academy, good luck getting your certification recognized by potential employers. Hell, there are actual real colleges that are brushed off when they pop up on resumes.

Students don't have to go that far into debt. They don't have to go to colleges that cost $50,000/year. They don't have to be unemployed while in school. There are always cheap options, grants and scholarships for people to graduate with minimal debt. Heck, I only applied to medical schools that would cost me <$30,000/year because I don't have to go $300,000 in debt. I have a choice.



#23 xjennibx

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:44 PM

It should but then this is life.. Life sucks



#24 savethekings

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:47 PM

College, and all higher education, should absolutely be free, or at least heavily subsidized. There is no reason that students should have to go hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt just to be able to get a degree, or even tens of thousands. As it stands, government grants and loans don't always cover everything, and working a minimum wage job in the USA sure as Hell doesn't. And that's assuming you get anything at all, since it's incredibly easy to be passed over for these sorts of things.

 

As for things like Khan Academy, good luck getting your certification recognized by potential employers. Hell, there are actual real colleges that are brushed off when they pop up on resumes.

That is why I said if education is your goal. Not if a degree is your goal.

 

Most people's main reason of going to college is to get a training on their future career, and Khan Academy isn't going to cut it most of the time. 

How many classes in college did you take that were actually applicable and useful for a career? Very few. I actually think the internet is a much more efficient way of learning, again if learning (not a degree) is your goal. Like Frizzle said, have an educated society is good. Universities aren't the only (or, even the best) way to do that.



#25 ortin

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 09:49 PM

Students don't have to go that far into debt. They don't have to go to colleges that cost $50,000/year. They don't have to be unemployed while in school. There are always cheap options, grants and scholarships for people to graduate with minimal debt. Heck, I only applied to medical schools that would cost me <$30,000/year because I don't have to go $300,000 in debt. I have a choice.

So, you're also saying students don't have to get a better education?


That is why I said if education is your goal. Not if a degree is your goal.

 

How many classes in college did you take that were actually applicable and useful for a career? Very few. I actually think the internet is a much more efficient way of learning, again if learning (not a degree) is your goal. Like Frizzle said, have an educated society is good. Universities aren't the only (or, even the best) way to do that.

Well, to take a personal example, I want to study cello. There is no way in hell that I will be learning cello through the internet. It's not possible.

But then again, this is a very case by case hypothetical question. For some careers, like engineering, it's pretty important to get the training in college. For other professions, not so much. 




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