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#51 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:31 PM

FUCK THE POLICE

My grandfather, a member of the Milwaukee PD for 33 years, was a very stand up man. kthx



#52 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:34 PM

"You know at first i was on the fence about being racist but now that i saw a group of black people doing something I don't approve of, I hate them all now. "

 

Makes perfect sense. In bizzaroworld.



#53 Padme

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:35 PM

My grandfather, a member of the Milwaukee PD for 33 years, was a very stand up man. kthx

 

OH WELL U KNOW LET ME ADJUST THAT...

 

 

FUCK THE POLICE...not Adam's papa tho BUT ALL THE REST



#54 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:36 PM

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OH WELL U KNOW LET ME ADJUST THAT...

 

 

FUCK THE POLICE...not Adam's papa tho BUT ALL THE REST

Yeah fuck all of the police! Every last one of them, including the non-bigoted juans :D.



#55 talbs

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:42 PM

FUCK THE POLICE

 

Well that's nice...



#56 Kaddict

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:44 PM

Where is the line between racist and not? It isn't binary. There is a spectrum. Some hick may want to shoot every person that is darker than him. That is pretty damn racist. But what about the 18 year old girl who locks her car door when she sees a black guy walk by her car, but never would treat anyone differently? Are they the same bit of racist? Racism stems from fear. It is just misplaced onto a community rather than the person/item/situation you fear. Racism can be caused. How do you think it is just something you are born with? How many 5 year olds are racist? How can you say you can't become racist? As humans we associate things as groups to save time. So, if you see a bunch of kids with mullets raping girls in the streets, you eventually are going to associate mullets with rape. That is a clear evolutionary trait. Racism can be caused when a certain group does things over and over. THAT DOESN'T MAKE RACISM OK. Also, that is why most people are racist. Most people are racist because they are ignorant pricks.

Let me ask you something, in story form. Lets say you move into a house. The previous tenants of your house hit a kid with their car. Your neighbors respond by breaking your windows, throwing bricks at you and calling for your death. You didn't have any biases towards this family before. Do you now? We can take it a step further and say their cousins stay at their place, don't participate in the name calling, but definitely don't say anything to stop it. Would you feel comfortable letting your kids play with their family, or even their cousins?



#57 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:53 PM

Serious question for the people who stand by "FUCK THE POLICE" stuff. Do you really think all cops are bad?



#58 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:53 PM

Where is the line between racist and not? It isn't binary. There is a spectrum. Some hick may want to shoot every person that is darker than him. That is pretty damn racist. But what about the 18 year old girl who locks her car door when she sees a black guy walk by her car, but never would treat anyone differently? Are they the same bit of racist? Racism stems from fear. It is just misplaced onto a community rather than the person/item/situation you fear. Racism can be caused. How do you think it is just something you are born with? How many 5 year olds are racist? How can you say you can't become racist?

Let me ask you something, in story form. Lets say you move into a house. The previous tenants of your house hit a kid with their car. Your neighbors respond by breaking your windows, throwing bricks at you and calling for your death. You didn't have any biases towards this family before. Do you now? We can take it a step further and say their cousins stay at their place, don't participate in the name calling, but definitely don't say anything to stop it. Would you feel comfortable letting your kids play with their family, or even their cousins?

 

 

lol wtf that's the definition of treating someone differently if you lock the door just because they walk past you while being born a certain way.

 

There's no grey-racism or diet racism. Racism is fucking racism. Take it from a person who actually experiences it. Someone clutching their purse when they walk past you is just as hurtful as someone yelling "go home nigger" at you while you're walking down the street. It's just as hurtful as cops deciding to "randomly" stop and search you for meth when you're on the way to school. It doesn't matter what these white people INTENTIONS are, what matters is the IMPACT IT HAS ON MARGINALIZED PEOPLE. It's not my problem if white people want to be stupid and generalize people. The issue comes when that kind of irrational fear, ignorance, and racism literally results in the deaths of people who look like me. Or mass incarceration of people who look like me. Or economic oppression of people who look like me. I'm not gonna cry for police who can't handle some people on the side of the road saying "fuck the police", I'm not gonna prioritize broken windows over broken spines. I dont understand why I have to keep trying to explain to you that it doesn't matter what happens, if something "turns" you racist, you were racist to begin with. There have been studies on children as young as five and yes they are socialized to have racial biases by that time. I hate having this conversation where white people are more concerned with being called a racist rather than the fact that they both actively and passively perpetuate racism.

 

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#59 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 04:57 PM

 There have been studies on children as young as five and yes they are socialized to have racial biases by that time. 

 

Yeah this shit sickens me. I saw a video of kids of the aforementioned age believing that black people are "bad", and "dirty" because their skin is darker colored. Shits fucked.



#60 Coops

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:02 PM

Serious question for the people who stand by "FUCK THE POLICE" stuff. Do you really think all cops are bad?

No. But ever since I learned about domestic violence in PDs, cover ups, brothers in blue culture, and civil asset seizure I don't think most cops are good. It's not entirely their fault though. There is little oversight. IA is a joke. Peer pressure and the pressure to be silent is real when your boss can ruin your life.

Edit: I also forgot how they treat disabled and mentally ill people. How they treat autistic people.

#61 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:15 PM

I'm pretty sure the movement would gain a substantial more number of supporters if we weren't damming all cops for the actions of some, but that could be just me. I just don't get it, and I think it's a bit hypocritical to be shouting that; why not say something like "FUCK THE SYSTEM"? All cops are being unfairly grouped into one lump as racists/wife beaters/murderers etc, just like black people are unfairly grouped together as wife beaters/murderers/thieves etc.

 

Side note: I am absolutely not downplaying the fact that blacks are hunted down; I've really started to believe it as of recent events -- watching those videos made my whole body sick.



#62 Coops

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:24 PM

I'm pretty sure the movement would gain a substantial more number of supporters if we weren't damming all cops for the actions of some, but that could be just me. I just don't get it, and I think it's a bit hypocritical to be shouting that; why not say something like "FUCK THE SYSTEM"? All cops are being unfairly grouped into one lump as racists/wife beaters/murderers etc, just like black people are unfairly grouped together as criminals, etc.

Side note: I am absolutely not downplaying the fact that blacks are hunted down; I've really started to believe it as of recent events -- watching those videos made my whole body sick.



You're conflating two things as if they are the same. But black people face nuanced racism and oppression, while cops do not. So comparing them doesn't hold up logically. Society can't oppress people overtly and implicitly and then expect them to protest nicely, or not use profanities.

#63 Tetiel

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:27 PM

So, the BLM movement is honestly causing cops that had no previous racial biases to become biased/frightened, and cops that already have the bias to have their bias confirmed and strengthened. So, in that sense, BLM is just causing more racism. So, the few violent BLM people to me are like the few violent cops. Screwing their cause and making the other side more frightened for their lives than they should be.

Maybe I can explain this better since there appears to be massive levels of misunderstanding.

Careful with that statement. The problem isn't the occasional violent protests or a few bad apple cops. That's a distraction. What do you honestly expect people to do when an unprecedented amount of people have been gunned down this year despite crime going down as a trend for decades? Say someone shot someone else. That person dies. The person who shot them gets paid vacation as a punishment and is never prosecuted. People are going to get angry. In some cases, violently angry especially when this just keeps happening and it doesn't seem like peace gets anything done. A kid with a toy gun, a kid with a bag of skittles, unarmed men, men who are lawfully armed but without brandishing their weapons, and I could go on for a long time. Yet you are becoming dangerously close to victim blaming here. Deep seeded racism caused many of these killings. Fear of people just because of their skin color with assumptions of violence occurred way before BLM did. When this has been going on for decades, hell, CENTURIES, you can't blame someone's racism on the people that racism systematically oppresses when they're rising up because enough is enough. That's the easy, guilt-free way out that only benefits one side and does nothing to fix the problem. Is violence helping? No. But the BLM movement as a whole is not causing racism. They're victims of racism rising up against racism.

Assuming all black people to be violent is racist. Judging the same of all cops is wrong as well. Don't blame victim for someone else's prejudice, . :\



#64 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:29 PM

I'm pretty sure the movement would gain a substantial more number of supporters if we weren't damming all cops for the actions of some, but that could be just me. I just don't get it, and I think it's a bit hypocritical to be shouting that; why not say something like "FUCK THE SYSTEM"? All cops are being unfairly grouped into one lump as racists/wife beaters/murderers etc, just like black people are unfairly grouped together as criminals, etc.

 

Side note: I am absolutely not downplaying the fact that blacks are hunted down; I've really started to believe it as of recent events -- watching those videos made my whole body sick.

 

The issue come from the fact that a lot of people think this is new. This isn't new. I remember someone posted a meme stating that the violence isn't new, it's the cameras that are new. Black people were nice as hell during Reconstruction Era and Jim Crow because they legally had to be. That didn't stop police harassment and brutality. This is a generational issue that is only getting worse because nothing seems to be getting done. People grow up hearing stories about their grandparents being harassed, seeing their parents being harassed, growing up being harassed themselves by an institutional system that operates with damn near impunity. Of course they're going to be pissed. But if we look, and really pay attention, to who has the institutional power in this scenario it doesn't make any sense to ask these people to be nicer about what they're experiencing. When it comes to police vs the predominantly poc and impoverished who have to deal with police more than anybody, the police have way more power and privilege to use their biases to impact peoples' lives than it does the other way around.



#65 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:29 PM

You're conflating two things as if they are the same. But black people face nuanced racism and oppression, while cops do not. So comparing them doesn't hold up logically. Society can't oppress people overtly and implicitly and then expect them to protest nicely, or not use profanities.

You're absolutely right, thank you for clarification. You'll never catch me saying "fuck the police", mostly out of respect for my grandfather. However, I will proudly say Black Lives Matter to anyone that asks.



#66 Coops

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:32 PM

You're absolutely right, thank you for clarification. You'll never catch me saying "fuck the police", mostly out of respect for my grandfather. However I will proudly say Black Lives Matter to anyone that asks.


It's called a false equivelancy. It happens. We all do it.

#67 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:36 PM

It's called a false equivelancy. It happens. We all do it.

But we all bleed red, so we're all the same. Amirite?  :p

 

The issue come from the fact that a lot of people think this is new. This isn't new. I remember someone posted a meme stating that the violence isn't new, it's the cameras that are new. Black people were nice as hell during Reconstruction Era and Jim Crow because they legally had to be. That didn't stop police harassment and brutality. This is a generational issue that is only getting worse because nothing seems to be getting done. People grow up hearing stories about their grandparents being harassed, seeing their parents being harassed, growing up being harassed themselves by an institutional system that operates with damn near impunity. Of course they're going to be pissed. But if we look, and really pay attention, to who has the institutional power in this scenario it doesn't make any sense to ask these people to be nicer about what they're experiencing. When it comes to police vs the predominantly poc and impoverished who have to deal with police more than anybody, the police have way more power and privilege to use their biases to impact peoples' lives than it does the other way around.

Absolutely, thank you for enlightening me. This is why I love codex so much because I (usually) get unbiased information from you lovely people. What's happening now reminds me of life in North Korea -- North Korean children are taught to hate American GI's, and Americans, in general from birth.

 

What's happening in America is beyond sad, and I wish it would all just stop. However, I understand that things need to get ugly before they get better.



#68 Tetiel

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:40 PM

You're absolutely right, thank you for clarification. You'll never catch me saying "fuck the police", mostly out of respect for my grandfather. However, I will proudly say Black Lives Matter to anyone that asks.

I think it's been said best by Trevor Noah - "In America, if you take a stand for something it's like you're automatically against something else... But with police shootings, it shouldn't have to work that way. For instance, if you’re pro Black Lives Matter you're assumed to be anti-police, and if you're pro-police, then you surely hate black people. When in reality, you can be pro-cop and pro-black."



#69 Adam

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 05:43 PM

I think it's been said best by Trevor Noah - "In America, if you take a stand for something it's like you're automatically against something else... But with police shootings, it shouldn't have to work that way. For instance, if you’re pro Black Lives Matter you're assumed to be anti-police, and if you're pro-police, then you surely hate black people. When in reality, you can be pro-cop and pro-black."

I actually saw that quote as a meme (because everything is a fucking meme these days...) the other day and thought it was very well put.



#70 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 08:50 PM

Edit: sorry, I don't mean to be snarky. But damn girl, try reading my posts before replying.

 

'I think it honestly comes back to the fact that the training for police officers is poor and the hiring process is biased. The fact that minorities are so painfully under represented, even in areas with huge minority populations, is ridiculous. Why was Chicago police force sued into hiring more minorities? There is a problem with prejudice within the police, of that I have no doubt, but instead of chanting 'fuck the police' I think chanting 'we demand minority representation in our local police department' is a lot more likely to result in change and less likely to incite violence.'

 

I read exactly what you said. It was still tone policing bullshit. Like I said, Black people have been nice about racial profiling, criminalization and racism for hundreds of years now. It has solved nothing.

 

Studies have shown that minorities in the police force are just as likely to have implicit bias against Blacks and Latinos as white police. Any other suggestions?



#71 Padme

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 09:14 PM

I'm so confused as to how to respond to you because absolutely no one here (I'm not caught up in this thread but at least prior posts) is debating any of this with you. You are literally responding to something that I am not saying. I say 'saying fuck the police is not constructive' and you say 'it's freedom of speech'. You do understand how we are having two totally different conversations here?


 

Are you capable of any form of higher thinking?

 

Nope. Definitely not. Especially when someone thinks anecdotal evidence is proof. lmfao. 

 

 

 

Serious question for the people who stand by "FUCK THE POLICE" stuff. Do you really think all cops are bad?

 

No I don't. No one that I know thinks that.

People have said 'Fuck the Police' for decades, they said it before NWA and they've said it after. 

 

Just like with anything, all groups chant. They have slogans or anything like that. You know how people call feminists 'man-haters' They don't usually mean ALL feminists they mean a group of them. How men call women bitches? How people call out Wall Street as being greedy ass douche canoes? People generalize about groups not to villanize(sp?) all of them but to make a point or express themselves.

 

What should BLM shout out? 'oh hey please don't kill us' or 'pls police us better' or 'pls dont racially profile me' etc. Shouting 'Fuck the Police' is true. It isn't about any single police office (there are plenty of shit ones tho.) It's about the establishment upon which they stand. A broken establishment that has built upon broken law after broken law. The whole thing needs to be reworked. 

 

I posted what I did for a reason and it isn't to disrespect the hard working police forces that many cities have but in general the system is broken and needs to be rebuilt. That doesn't happen peacefully as history has taught us. I support the Black community as best as I can but as a middle class, white, young female I can only do so much, it isn't my fight to define how they should get what they deserve.



#72 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 09:17 PM

Woman's suffrage and civil rights seemed to be pretty non-violent. But those were unimportantish.

 

Please read up on women's suffrage and civil rights. Women and minorities got the shit beat out of them for those rights and if you think we're gonna go through that shit again in 2016 you're sorely mistaken.



#73 Tetiel

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 09:24 PM

Cara, as someone who has lived in both Canada and America... particularly even knowing supposed "rough areas" of Toronto like Jane and Finch and living in the Rexdale area of Etobicoke, as much as I wish it were, Canada is not America. America makes me want to puke sometimes in comparison. Canada made me wake up from the small town white girl upper middle class listening to conservative radio to and from school every day persperective. Canada takes care of its people - white, black, brown, whatever color. The government has made incredible apologies for how it has acted in the past. It has and will continue to make leaps and bounds, being progressively decades ahead of other nations on its hemisphere on a wide variety of issues - medical rights, marriage equality, health disparities, gender equality.

As much as I genuinely hate saying this, your anecdotal experience in Canada does not really apply to what is going on right now in America. I wish it were valid. I really wish it were, but we're not there yet. Consider this - America's slaves fled north to Canada specifically because Canada didn't allow slavery. That was the very point of the underground railroad. Canada has always treated those of African descent better than America has.



#74 Tetiel

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 10:05 PM

But that wasn't your question. Your question was 

 

 and I answered it. You seem to never address points. It seems like it would be difficult to have a conversation with someone as tangential as you.

 

Plus, if POC are getting beaten and killed already, why not do what suffrage did? Is it not a worthy cause? 

You seem intent to keep bringing up the nonviolence of Women's Suffrage and I will raise you two words: Kitty Marion. She was an actress forced to give sex in return for lead roles and passed around to patrons in taxis. She decided enough was enough and pipe bombed Alexandria Park. Other involved acts committed by many women were arson, property damage, bombings, and suicide attempts in public places. But please, tell me how peaceful history has painted rape victims and people robbed of any option besides being breeders. We don't learn of these people in our history books, but it doesn't make it any less true.



#75 Mishelle

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 10:29 PM

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