174 replies to this topic

[Adam]

Is there a way to go back to using the old .exe? Having to buy a proxy is ballsack.

[Perdita]

Is the Pet Trainer not aware that you can train Endurance up to three times your level?

 

Apart from that, are there any news on the financing and such of VS?

[Purrina]

 

All but 3 of my accounts are now gone, entirely. Not listed under accounts. I wonder if the database got wiped :-\

 

04/29/2019 20:33:01 is my last working timestamp with an account that no longer shows up. What's going on...

 

 

Same thing happened to me, all my accounts just vanished out of ValorSuite.

 

I waited until my logs were clear to see if the accounts would come back, but they didn't.

 

I created a new VS account, and began the tedious process of entering all Neopets accounts and schedulers again.

 

Feature Request: It would be nice to be able to download a copy of our accounts and schedules, so we could re-upload our accounts and schedule information if/when there were any issues in ValorSuite.

 

Then I went to delete my old VS account - and found that despite the assurances that "Deleting this data will permanently remove your account, and this cannot be recovered." you click the button, and ... nothing happened.

You are taken to a blank page.

If you go to login, your account is still there.

So, I'm really not happy there's no way to even remove my information, except to wait for ValorSuite to decide to randomly erase it.

 

Bug Fix: Let users delete their accounts and remove their information.

 

 

Is there a way to go back to using the old .exe? Having to buy a proxy is ballsack.

 

AFAIK the windows app was discontinued when the web based version came out.

 

As a mac user, I never got to try the previous windows app - but from what others wrote, it sounds like it was far more complete and had less issues. Plus it didn't require a proxy, and could be used with a VPN. I would have liked to have tried it. Especially in this current situation where some bugs are creeping into the web app, it would have been a great bridge to bot different aspects of Neopets.

 

I've got to imagine there's copies of the windows app out there, so I have to ask -- were all previous copies of the windows app disabled from running?

 

 

Is the Pet Trainer not aware that you can train Endurance up to three times your level?

 

Apart from that, are there any news on the financing and such of VS?

 

It appears PetTrainer tries to keep all stats even.

I didn't see an option to overtrain HP - though I suppose you can manually do it by enabling "train HP only" - but then you constantly have to manage when you have reached 3x and need to train other stats.

 

Feature request: Give users the option to have the pet trainer "keep stats even" or "overtrain HP to 3x"

 

Between bug fixes and financing, I'm more interested in hearing about bug fixes myself, since some rather serious ones do seem to be popping up.

However, something that really bothers me is that earlier in the thread Valorous said hundreds of accounts were logged into ValorSuite at any given time. There's been maybe 6 of us here to talk about the current financial problems ValorSuite faces.

I think we can all recognize that this forum is rather quiet -- so perhaps if we need to work toward getting this problem solved, we need to bring attention to it where the users will see it - for me, this means the login page of ValorSuite.

I'll again echo Perdita's wonderful suggestion of a donate button as a first line of financial relief. Perhaps with a bit of income it would serve as a good motivation toward getting the bug fixes completed, and maybe even work toward some feature requests too.

 

---

 

Valorous, I appreciate all the hard work you have done on ValorSuite. Using ValorSuite really has made Neopets much more enjoyable for me. Thank you.

You've stated one of the biggest challenges is that ValorSuite has never been self-sustaining and is losing money. The community has come up with several options for you to consider -- donations, lower tier account packages, cross-promotion monthly subscriptions that tie-in with NC Abrosia -- you DO have options to make ValorSuite reach the goal of being self-supporting and even profitable for you.

I would be willing to donate or to commit to a lower cost monthly subscription to support both your hard work and offset server costs, etc - but the community really needs to hear from you as to where you want this to go.

... You are missed.

[Perdita]

I've got to imagine there's copies of the windows app out there, so I have to ask -- were all previous copies of the windows app disabled from running?

Mine randomly stopped working some days after it was officially discountinued. I don't remember the exact error message, but it wouldn't even start. The program had the Kitchen Quester and the Shapeshifter solver; both programs I miss and that I can't find anywhere else.

 

 

I didn't see an option to overtrain HP - though I suppose you can manually do it by enabling "train HP only" - but then you constantly have to manage when you have reached 3x and need to train other stats.

That doesn't work. I tried it and it says it can't train my pet due to my settings.

 

 

I second the suggestion to put up a donate button before doing anything else. Purrina, I also remember having seen a Donate link in a year-old post that has since been taken down (the link, I mean). While I can imagine money won't lead to bugs getting fixed now - as it won't get Valorous more time - it's important that the project at least doesn't cost him money.

[Purrina]

Mine randomly stopped working some days after it was officially discountinued. I don't remember the exact error message, but it wouldn't even start. The program had the Kitchen Quester and the Shapeshifter solver; both programs I miss and that I can't find anywhere else.

 

 

That doesn't work. I tried it and it says it can't train my pet due to my settings.

 

 

I second the suggestion to put up a donate button before doing anything else. Purrina, I also remember having seen a Donate link in a year-old post that has since been taken down (the link, I mean). While I can imagine money won't lead to bugs getting fixed now - as it won't get Valorous more time - it's important that the project at least doesn't cost him money.

 

Wow, a fully functional Kitchen Quester and Shapeshifter Solver sounds awesome. I wish I would have had a chance to try the previous ValorSuite.

It sounds like even if the current web app was bug free, it would still provide useful bots for players to use.

 

There is a functional GM/TM script kitchen quester out there (I don't believe I can say where, or link to it - sorry!) but I haven't seen a functional Shapeshifter solver yet. A few have claimed it, but I've never seen a functional one complete yet.

 

Hmm, only thing I can think of is that I don't think overtraining HP works in Swashbuckling Academy - I think it's Mystery Island only.

If you haven't tried this already, could you try it with a pet who's level is too high for Pirate Academy and requires MI Codestone training? Maybe that might "force" VS to send the pet to the right school.

However, if it's hard coded to keep stats equal - I'm afraid there's nothing we can do but ask Valorous to make and option for the 3x HP training.

I'll cross my fingers, but beyond that I'm out of ideas to make it work.

 

Agreed, I remember the donate button too - and I think it went down when premium subscriptions went up.

[Adam]

AFAIK the windows app was discontinued when the web based version came out.

 

 

As a mac user, I never got to try the previous windows app - but from what others wrote, it sounds like it was far more complete and had less issues. Plus it didn't require a proxy, and could be used with a VPN. I would have liked to have tried it. Especially in this current situation where some bugs are creeping into the web app, it would have been a great bridge to bot different aspects of Neopets.

 

I've got to imagine there's copies of the windows app out there, so I have to ask -- were all previous copies of the windows app disabled from running?

 

 

@Purrina - I have the original VS on one of my hard drives, but it errors out upon updating.

[Purrina]

 I have the original VS on one of my hard drives, but it errors out upon updating.

 

Thanks for letting me know.

It sounds like Valorous was 'encouraging'  users to move from the old app to the new web-based app - which would have been ok, if it offered the same things and didn't require a proxy.

 

I know from reading here that requiring a proxy seems to be a dealbreaker for many users.

 

Also, it seems like even if Valorous came back today and fixed all the bugs in ValorSuite Web, that the windows app offers unique bots (such as the kitchen quester and shapeshifter solver) that I would be interested in having.

[kuwaz]

@Valorous

 

If I had to guess, most of your expenses are for the servers, so why not just outsource the hosting to the end user and let people host the webapp themselves? Maybe charge people a one time fee for software itself and offer free updates, then charge for premium version updates.

 

Regardless of what happens, you'll be making some money on just the code itself. Even if people decide to pirate the software, you'll still make some money on the premium version updates. This is better than a net loss just to run some DRM on the software.

 

Basically the same model that most open-source software startups use, the software itself is free, but the enterprise features, updates, and support are not.

Edited by kuwaz, 14 May 2019 - 08:14 AM.

[Valorous]

To avoid making an enormous quote I will refrain from quoting individual posts.

 

• Every bot that was in the old ValorSuite is at least partially implemented in VSW. In most cases just the views (page to edit settings) are not functional or there are minor bugs. It would probably take less than 40 man-hours to have all of the functionality of the original ValorSuite working (besides Shapeshifter -- that requires the desktop client as below).
• If the admins want to package ValorSuite that is fine with me.
• The intention was for users to use their machine as a proxy using a desktop client or other proxy server (of which there are many free open source ones). Buying a proxy was "Plan B".
• There is no way to go back to the old exe. The server that old copies required no longer exists and I do not have the source code to it.
• Pet trainer does not currently train to 3x endurance. I would need dev time to fix this.
• Thank you for the report on deleting your account. I will add this to the top of my to-do list.

 

Rant warning regarding giving this web application to users:

• Malicious actors will attempt to use it to steal accounts from unwitting users ( www.totallynotVSWdeployedwiththeintentofstealingaccountinformation.com ) causing an enormous shitshow that would damage credibility.
• When it was an exe that users could run I was still in the red on server costs (central server was still needed with the exe) and enough money never came in (still in the red with hosting fees only $1.79/mo)
• It was much harder to debug.
• I considered quitting many times do to a mix of debugging when I have no access to html that is run on clients machines (this will happen again) -- having to remote in to clients machines and general financial problems from server costs.
• Whenever I implemented error logging back to my servers antivirus was flagging on it then I would have to handle correspondence with antivirus companies to clear this (time and money -- money x2 that was not being replaced).
• I also had to deal with the people that criticized running unknown code on their machines then those same types of people criticized having to store neopets accounts credentials securely on my servers when running my binaries could have potentially far worse implications if I were a malicious actor.
• I strongly believe a centralized web application with a desktop client to be the best of all worlds. I am considering switching this to a paid service only with a different pricing scheme to ensure server costs are paid, desktop clients are maintained and buy enough development time to keep the software feature rich and bug free. Payment scheme would likely be $1/mo per Neopets account with some minimum amount ($5/mo?). The free tier would no longer exist.

 

As of right now I am in the red with this project and I struggle every month to not pull the plug on this project.

[kuwaz]

To avoid making an enormous quote I will refrain from quoting individual posts.

 

• Every bot that was in the old ValorSuite is at least partially implemented in VSW. In most cases just the views (page to edit settings) are not functional or there are minor bugs. It would probably take less than 40 man-hours to have all of the functionality of the original ValorSuite working (besides Shapeshifter -- that requires the desktop client as below).
• If the admins want to package ValorSuite that is fine with me.
• The intention was for users to use their machine as a proxy using a desktop client or other proxy server (of which there are many free open source ones). Buying a proxy was "Plan B".
• There is no way to go back to the old exe. The server that old copies required no longer exists and I do not have the source code to it.
• Pet trainer does not currently train to 3x endurance. I would need dev time to fix this.
• Thank you for the report on deleting your account. I will add this to the top of my to-do list.

 

Rant warning regarding giving this web application to users:

• Malicious actors will attempt to use it to steal accounts from unwitting users ( www.totallynotVSWdeployedwiththeintentofstealingaccountinformation.com ) causing an enormous shitshow that would damage credibility.
• When it was an exe that users could run I was still in the red on server costs (central server was still needed with the exe) and enough money never came in (still in the red with hosting fees only $1.79/mo)
• It was much harder to debug.
• I considered quitting many times do to a mix of debugging when I have no access to html that is run on clients machines (this will happen again) -- having to remote in to clients machines and general financial problems from server costs.
• Whenever I implemented error logging back to my servers antivirus was flagging on it then I would have to handle correspondence with antivirus companies to clear this (time and money -- money x2 that was not being replaced).
• I also had to deal with the people that criticized running unknown code on their machines then those same types of people criticized having to store neopets accounts credentials securely on my servers when running my binaries could have potentially far worse implications if I were a malicious actor.
• I strongly believe a centralized web application with a desktop client to be the best of all worlds. I am considering switching this to a paid service only with a different pricing scheme to ensure server costs are paid, desktop clients are maintained and buy enough development time to keep the software feature rich and bug free. Payment scheme would likely be $1/mo per Neopets account with some minimum amount ($5/mo?). The free tier would no longer exist.

 

As of right now I am in the red with this project and I struggle every month to not pull the plug on this project.

 

Have you also considered putting Google ads on your webapp, I used to make decent income from that alone.

[Ghartun]

Yet again I've been not able to use the site because it doesn't accept any proxy I can offer. I can't and won't buy a premium proxy for it, just hoping this option turns optional, it's really dumb to have it as mandatory.

[Daviid]

The only "bad thing" I see there, is the minimum payment that'll drive away users that do not need or want to use 5 accounts.

Just happened to read this, I've never used the program so my opinion might not mean much.

[SuperDuperPuppu]

 

It's working now  

 

For anyone else struggling with their account being disabled for latency issues - I was using username/password authentication with my proxy. Talk with your proxy provider and see if they offer "IP authentication" Switching to that solved my problem.

 

A HUGE ~Thank You~ to @Valorous for doing so much testing, and for being so helpful and patient to help me figure this out.

I really appreciate all your help!

@Purrina (or whoever knows), what is ValorSuite's IP to allow for authentication?

 

I'm running into the same issue, and I also have the option to use IP authentication.

[Purrina]

@Purrina (or whoever knows), what is ValorSuite's IP to allow for authentication?

 

I'm running into the same issue, and I also have the option to use IP authentication.

 

When you have a proxy that is paid for, there are two ways to verify who is using it.

The first is username/password, and the 2nd is IP authentication. (more on that in a minute)

 

With username/password, I found that the paid proxy I used was near-unusable -- I couldn't AB nearly anything, couldn't Money Tree Grab - I was always too slow. I was really grumpy because my host was all "unlimited speeds", etc. It turns out the delay I was seeing was actually being caused by username/password authentication. It's an extra little bit of data that needs to be sent along and processed by the host, to verify that you actually are entitled to be using the proxy. Though it may not sound like much more then a few milliseconds -- it can be the difference between AB'ing a Faerie Krawk MP and ending up with a Split Lenny MP.

 

Valorous helped me set up IP authentication with my host, and it was a HUGE difference.

What "IP authentication" means is - every time a request is sent to the proxy host, the host verifies the IP the request came from automatically - no extra data (like (username/password) needs to be sent. By saving a few milliseconds, it will improve your latency in all areas of the site (and anywhere else you use the proxy, as well).

You will need to talk to your proxy host, and first see how many IP's they allow you to auth. I've seen anywhere from 1-10 IP's allowed, depending on the host. Ideally, you would like at least 2 IP's to auth -- one for your own IP and 1 for VSWeb.

The only problem will be that you will need to PM @Valorous to have him help you set up the IP auth, and he's been busy lately. You can use the username/password auth while you wait, but it will be a bit slower then IP Auth.

 

Disclaimer: I'm not very techie; this is just how things worked with my proxy host. If anyone wants to jump in and add more/better info, please do!

[renegade]

Getting a consistent 522 error over the past half hour or so, timed out connection due to host.

[Valorous]

Update

Hosting is down. Ran out of money for the project.

[Purrina]

Edit to update: please disregard my initial post, I was posting about the Cloudflare timeout error near the same time Valorous was replying about hosting being down.

---

Thank you @Valorous for all you have done to make ValorSuite Web available to so many users for so long. You've given a lot of enjoyment to many Neopets players through your code and hosting, and it is appreciated you kept it going as long as you did.

I feel disappointed that many have come forward with ideas on how to keep VSWeb online, and so far it seems like you haven't been willing to try, or even acknowledge any of them.
Specifically, I thought the idea suggested by kuwaz about Google Ads could be quite viable - along with bringing a link for the donations back to the VSWeb login page as Perdita suggested.

 

I strongly believe a centralized web application with a desktop client to be the best of all worlds. I am considering switching this to a paid service only with a different pricing scheme to ensure server costs are paid, desktop clients are maintained and buy enough development time to keep the software feature rich and bug free. Payment scheme would likely be $1/mo per Neopets account with some minimum amount ($5/mo?). The free tier would no longer exist.

I had a bit of trouble understanding this last paragraph, but I think it was intended as a standalone paragraph and not a bullet point under the "web app to users" section. It makes more sense when read that way, so I'll hope I am correct.

I had hoped you would be willing to keep VSWeb going at least until there was another option for users to switch to.

When you do create your app, will it be universal or will it be windows only (thus excluding mac users)?
Would there still be an option to use multiple accounts on separate IPs (with our own proxies) in the (future) web+desktop version?

If the desktop client runs on mac, consider me interested in being a monthly subscriber with all the accounts I currently have in VSWeb.
If it's windows only, that's going to be a problem for me. One of the best things about VSWeb is it wasn't specific to any one OS and could be used anywhere you could use a browser. I hope your future projects would be equally accessible and include mac users.

 

As of right now I am in the red with this project and I struggle every month to not pull the plug on this project.

Again, thank you for going so far to keep so many Neopets players like myself happy with VSWeb.
If you would consider adding a donate button, I would be happy to send you a bit of financial support - and I'm sure many others would too.

Several users want to help you brainstorm a way to help make ValorSuite Web worth your time to support.
One of the bigger issues I personally face is that for mac users like myself, I feel VSWeb is the best option out there.
Please let us help you keep ValorSuite Web alive, at least until there's another option available (like your new project).
Thank you for considering my suggestions.

Edited by Purrina, 01 June 2019 - 02:36 PM.

[Renoy]

How much is the hosting per month?

[Adam]

Can't you set up a cheap home server, set up like a reverse proxy and host it off of that?

[Akari]

Update

Hosting is down. Ran out of money for the project.

 

I'm pretty sad right now because of this.

[KaibaSama]

Update

Hosting is down. Ran out of money for the project.

Thanks for all you've put into this project. You did your very best and sometimes these things happen. One day you may find a way to continue, but I'm still glad we had it for the time we did. 

[Akari]

I'm crying

[Bendida]

@Valorous I'd gladly pay a dollar a month for all my 10+ accounts (so 10 dollars/month at least) but I'm not willing nor able to buy proxies and I don't have the slightest idea how to set up my computer as a proxy or whatever can be done. So you'll have my subscription (I'm missing the .exe version so, so much and of course I could never use the web version, and all other programs I'm using aren't as good as yours) but you'll need to help people like me figure it out

Edited by Bendida, 02 June 2019 - 12:17 PM.

[Renoy]

Yeah I'd pay that per account but I was wondering if there was ever a donate button etc.

 

@Valorous are you not taking donations at all to bring the server back up? I would love to do so in order to use the service again.

Edited by Renoy, 02 July 2019 - 05:59 PM.

[Akari]

I miss this Webapp