229 replies to this topic

[Ives]

Mad, or pissed, would not be the appropiate word. Jesus is going to return, and then take us christians up with him to heaven. Then God will remove the holy spirit from the world (Which is your sense of right and wrong) and leave it to fend for it's self while the tribluation comes. Eventually the world still start falling apart because of all the sinners, and God will do his things (Read Revelations) and eventually finish the world as we know it.

As soon as I see jesus is as soon as I believe in him, therefore, im not royally screwed? I dont see it saying that conversion to christianity must occur beforehand

[darkmaster]

I think it will and when it happens the sun will explode and kill everyone in the intire universe

[Tetiel]

As soon as I see jesus is as soon as I believe in him, therefore, im not royally screwed? I dont see it saying that conversion to christianity must occur beforehand

I'm not trying to start a debate with you or anything, but the point of faith is that you don't need proof in order to believe and that is pretty much what Christianity is about, in my opinion. So yes, with your scientific mind you need proof and honestly I have a hard time believing myself in a lot of things in the bible, but in being a Christian it is important to have faith. While it is not my personal belief that you will go to hell if you're not a Christian, for those that do believe that from what I understand their thinking is like this: When you've had an opporitunity to accept Jesus and rejected it and waited till there was proof to finally believe then you are not one of faith and do not deserve to be in heaven. Honestly I just think that what you need to do in life to go to heaven is just be a good person and honestly atone for what you have done wrong and I think you're alright. I don't think that God damns people to hell for not believing in him because there are so many different reasons that some people wouldn't, say you were never told about him? Say you were a baby and were incapable before you died, say you were driven away by fire and brimstone Christians so you never wanted to be apart of the church, say you have never seen a church that is right for you... I don't think that God would send you to hell for not just believing in Christ...

But anyways... that's a bit off subject, no? Back on subject...

I think that the bible will come true but only with its symbolism. Of course I don't think a beast will rise out of the waters with the whore of babylon as its mother, but I think that a baby could very likely be born from a mother who is a curroption, a "whore" perhaps you could say. And that baby could be extremely intelligent, that baby could surpass us all and slowly start to dominate the world. That baby as s/he grows could very well be the anti-christ and speed us forward to our sinful doom. And when that happens it could be very likely that Christ could come again, but I think that God will make him reborn again and be human just like before. I normally am not an extremely religous person, but I have read Revalation and a lot of it I could just see happening to our world and maybe it is happening already, I don't know. But I could definately see it as an end... and I could very well be wrong, but if I was well then... oh well, I'd be dead anyways

[Curse]

So says what you believe, that isn't the belief of all people, and cannot be stated as a fact. Just as I can't say that Jesus is the son of God factually (though I believe it to be so), you cannot factually say that he isn't.

I had never said that last bit was a fact.

Bigbone, be realistic. Either cite a version of the Bible with a drunk, black Jesus or don't say such far-fetched things.

Why does Brad have negative 1292 posts?

It's true, the Christan bible right now that many think to follow has a load of BS in it that makes no sense. Jesus has blue eyes and blond hair if you see him on T.V. He was born in Bethlehem, he sure did not have blue eyes and blond hair.

[|nfinite]

I don't know the exact verse where it describes Jesus himself, but I believe it was something to the effect of:

"Tall, Dark, With Hair like Sheeps Wool"

Something like that.

Why does it matter if he was white or black?

[Ives]

I'm not trying to start a debate with you or anything, but the point of faith is that you don't need proof in order to believe and that is pretty much what Christianity is about, in my opinion. So yes, with your scientific mind you need proof and honestly I have a hard time believing myself in a lot of things in the bible, but in being a Christian it is important to have faith. While it is not my personal belief that you will go to hell if you're not a Christian, for those that do believe that from what I understand their thinking is like this: When you've had an opporitunity to accept Jesus and rejected it and waited till there was proof to finally believe then you are not one of faith and do not deserve to be in heaven. Honestly I just think that what you need to do in life to go to heaven is just be a good person and honestly atone for what you have done wrong and I think you're alright. I don't think that God damns people to hell for not believing in him because there are so many different reasons that some people wouldn't, say you were never told about him? Say you were a baby and were incapable before you died, say you were driven away by fire and brimstone Christians so you never wanted to be apart of the church, say you have never seen a church that is right for you... I don't think that God would send you to hell for not just believing in Christ...

Yeah lmao I agree (even though not a christian) but I'd love to do something like convert to christianity the day before the end and no one knows its the end.

[Tetiel]

It's true, the Christan bible right now that many think to follow has a load of BS in it that makes no sense. Jesus has blue eyes and blond hair if you see him on T.V. He was born in Bethlehem, he sure did not have blue eyes and blond hair.

Ummm... hun do you know that because you see it on TV it doesn't mean it was in the bible? You have YET to actually give proof that the bible has been changed. There is no biblical verse that says he had blonde hair and blue eyes. None whatsoever.

Why does he have blonde hair and blue eyes? It's simply European culture tradition. Back in the very early days of Europe we had racism just the same and that is most likely why Jesus started out by becoming pictured as of caucasian descent (not known exactly for sure but that is the most accepted theory). But does it MATTER what race Jesus Christ is potrayed as? Really... it's not about the race, it's about the IDEA. The bible never once states how he is potrayed... we only have what we have seen from so many painting and when you see so many images as a little kid it is hard to change your image of that person. So even if for some reason you actually CARE about the race of Jesus that would be the reason why he is potrayed like that.

But again like people have asked you several times in this topic... PLEASE post solid proof. Again you have yet to do so to support your accusation.

[Frizzle]

Well think of it this way? Where did his Mary and Joesph come from? And where was he born? They will probably decide what colour he was. Although anyone could say "He's the son of God and could be any colour whatsoever" yadayada.

I hope he is black/dark toned etc.., it'll be quite funny to see the look on alot of KKK and Neo-Nazi members.

[Cooliodoc]

I personally hope he is a cool shade of blue with purple eyes and tail. I'm not sure why.....

[Brad]

I personally hope he is a cool shade of blue with purple eyes and tail. I'm not sure why.....

WRONG! Jesus is... Batman!
I'd be quite surprised if Jesus was white in fact.


Though, if we want to take into account the several apparitions of the blessed virgin, she's usually seen as being the same race as the people she appears to.

[Ives]

Like tet said, it doesn't matter about His image. You have no clue whether he gave the first artist to draw Him the true image of Him, or something to get us thinking. I think it was to get us thinking, because his image shouldn't matter. It wasn't like today back then when there is racisem everywhere.

Yeah. The romans just uhhh took over everyone, so of course they werent racist, everyone was part of rome

[cara]

Oh goodness, this is even better, how fun

Okay, first off where in the hell in this whole topic did I say "It must not be true". I'm completely lost in what the hell your talking about, because that was the ahteist over there saying that, not me. Now, listen closely, I'll put in caps just in case your blind. STOP SAYING SHIT WITHOUT BACKUP. Get that? I'm tired of hearing "it has been proven wrong", where!? At least I provided logical evidence

Your hiliarous. We think were powerful? Please, your worse them my 7 year old sister with these constant lies. You have NO room to talk, as you have never been a christian and have no clue how we think. If you knew anything, you would have never EVER said that. Oh yea, can you prove there is no God? No. =/

Don't you think it's better to at least believe that your going to go somewhere instead of believing in shit? I would rather think I actually have a meaning on this earth...

If someone is not strong in their religion, there better off not even calling themselves what ever their term may be. And what about you? Once again you have no room to talk. Your sitting here talking all this shit about how my religion is nothing but bullshit and your's is the right one....

Okay, wanna be a bitch about christians? Atheists are the MOST CLOSE MINDED PEOPLE I HAVE EVER MET. Really, I know many of them that will not accept anything. Nothing! "No I'm atheist I don't believe in a religion", it's like an autmated respone =/

You seriously have a sterotyping problem. You think every chrisitan in the world is like the one at your school. See, if you were a chrisitan you would understand this. There are many different types of christians, not to many, but some most people don't even consider christian.

ROTFL HAHAHHAHAHHA. Okay, im literally cracking up at that last paragraph. First off, please show me where God killed people in the Old Testament. Second off, once again talking about something we have no clue about, God killed his son so instead of all of us going to hell, we had a chance, which some people like you abuse and treat like shit.

So, please educate yourself before coming back here.

Okay , I suppose you make *some* points there , but you were quit harsh speaking
that was about about Atheists.Iam not christen , I'm more into Juddism , so In my defense I honestly Can't say anything about them , due to me not knowing much.
I don't think he ment to ( In your words ) 'bitch about christens' he's making honest , TRUTHFUL statments.You can believe what you want but you can't force people into believing them.They have to choose their own path to god , not in Atheists cases.
-But notice how so many religions say they're the 'chosen ones' , the jews say that , the Athiests say that , Cathlics ( Not 100% sure ) say that , Hindus ( Not 100% sure ) say that and expesially Jahova Witnesses.
RELIGION WAS MADE BY MAN. You must choose your own religion , it's called FREE WILL.
-And ( Me to ) MANY , MANY people of all religions try to convert me at my school , and no matter how many times I tell them I HAVE FREE WILL , I can be whetever relion I want , they still try to.

Mad, or pissed, would not be the appropiate word. Jesus is going to return, and then take us christians up with him to heaven. Then God will remove the holy spirit from the world (Which is your sense of right and wrong) and leave it to fend for it's self while the tribluation comes. Eventually the world still start falling apart because of all the sinners, and God will do his things (Read Revelations) and eventually finish the world as we know it.

You are so apsent minded it makes me SICK.
SO WHAT EXACTLY YOUR SAYING IS THAT GOD WILL REJECT ALL THE OTHER RELIGIONS DUE TO HIM ' FAVORING ' THE RIGHT RELIGION.YOU DISCUST ME.
Just because we are wrong ( HYPERTHETICALLY SPEAKING ) doesnt mean god will leave us to parish.-And , even if the Cathlics go raping children , murdering people , tell me , oh wise one , will god still take them up into heaven?Do there sins not matter?
-And if , hypertheitically speaking , christens are right , WHY WOULD GOD REJECT US?Because we are wrong?What if we live a good , honest life?
-But whatever helps you sleep better at night.
EDIT:
-And if god/Jesus wanted us to believe in him wouldn't he show some sign , or come down and tell us?

As soon as I see jesus is as soon as I believe in him, therefore, im not royally screwed? I dont see it saying that conversion to christianity must occur beforehand

I'm starting to think you're the only one in this board that isnt crazy.

I think it will and when it happens the sun will explode and kill everyone in the intire universe

Please tell me you have a logical explination behind that.

I personally hope he is a cool shade of blue with purple eyes and tail. I'm not sure why.....

You really picked my curiosity there,

Edited by xXxBrok3nxXx, 06 January 2006 - 12:18 PM.

[Tetiel]

Your a sinner, you were born one and still are one. You may do good things, but good things do not hide the sinner you are. You may join another religion and do good things, you still have the sin from when you were born.

Now I agree with most of the things you said but this one made me raise an eyebrow. I just have a different thinking. I think that children are automatically born innocent and do not have sin on their records at all. I mean... how are they guilty of anything? They have never and are incapable of doing anything wrong as they were just born. Yeah, people ae sinners, I'm not arguing with you there, but I just don't think a baby that was just born is a sinner. They just haven't had the opporitunity whatsoever. And I also don't think a baby would have to accept Jesus either. Babies die all of the time... way before they have ever had the opporitunity to accept Christ... are they stuck in hell or limbo? I would think they would go to heaven even if they haven't accepted Him.

So please do explain your thinking. I'm interested to hear it

[Ives]

I'm crazy? And believing people grew from monkeys that started from microscopic algae isn't crazy? Believing a theory that has been proven wrong publically, then trying to defend it, isn't crazy? Please then, define crazy for me.

Where has it been proven completely wrong? I'm simply wondering, supply 3 sources please (Should be easy) .

Oh, and I also think its crazy that there could be a god that created everything.I look at it this way :

For god to have made the universe he must be even more complex than his creation (eg a human is more complex than a computer and he made a computer, a computer can't make a human). Therefore, by christian logic, God can't exist since according to religion, no one made God

A friend of mine posted that argument at another site. I'm sure you have a reasonable comeback to that .

Look, I just don't want to confirm any faith. From what I see in this world, humans, while pure hearted, are stupid and rely off of passion, therefore create a lot of tension in areas of religion. So yeah, I've been called an idiot for that since humans must rely off of some faith, but meh. I dont believe evolution exactly, since why the hell are there monkies (it's been argued that its because some regional areas evolved, others didnt, but I dont understand that concept too much yet its as simple as differences in weather in areas {eg Austraila and US are at different weather schemes}).

I also think personally if it can be described by humans, it is created by humans or nature. therefore, sending my faith into atheism a lot more.

I used to be Christian. I grew up in a similar pattern to you Alias. I grew up feeling touched, served in youth, etc. However, the main loss of faith was the fact my pastor admitted to atheism and my personal expirience learning religious history.

[cara]

First thing, what does free will have to do with anything? You have free will, we have the right to share our ideas. If someone told me they had free will while I was informing them of God, I would just laugh. One thing, the only reason you have it is because God, another thing it has nothing to do with the conversation. That's great that you have it, now use the intelligence God gave you and make the wise choice with it.

And of course other religions say they are the right one. It must say that in the Bible 20+ times about how many false religions will arise and claim themselves as the true religion. It has yet to begin, soon false prophets claiming to be Jesus will appear, and will do alot of black magic which will lose alot of people, yea this is just the beggining.

Favoring the right religon? Are you high? He started the religon. What, you think God said "Oh I think I like christianity, yea, that sounds good to me" and decided to send all others to hell? Then how in the hell am I "SICK"?

Do you even know what a religion is? I don't even call christianity a "religion", it's just the right thing to do period. Never has the Bible been proven to hold lies, nor contradictory's, or any of the related. One of the only religions (to my knowledge) to hold such a record. Not to mention the many prophecies that have held true.

Wrong? So your saying just because I killed that person doesn't mean I should goto jail because I was wrong about thinking it was the right thing to do. Even though the law was right infront of me, I just choose to ignore it and do something else, I didn't know it was "wrong". Yea, that's what your saying, and how about you try and find logical sense in that for me k?

Did you even read this debate? Your saying the same shit everyone else said that I already replied and made sense of. Your a sinner, you were born one and still are one. You may do good things, but good things do not hide the sinner you are. You may join another religion and do good things, you still have the sin from when you were born. THE ONLY WAY TO GET RID OF THE SIN IS TO ACCEPT JESUS. Get it? Only Jesus has the power to forgive you of the sin, and that power came when he set foot upon this earth ONLY to die for us so we even had that right.

He shouldn't have to give us signs. You are so weak, just like everyone else. "No I have to see it to believe it", oh poor poor you. I have the Bible infront of me, the things it says are coming true, it makes perfect sense, but without seeing anything I thinks it's all bs. More great logic you want to explain?

I'm crazy? And believing people grew from monkeys that started from microscopic algae isn't crazy? Believing a theory that has been proven wrong publically, then trying to defend it, isn't crazy? Please then, define crazy for me.

Sooo, yea please either go and educate yourself some more, or actually read most of this debate, then come back.

Seriously , this is starting to get sad.Don't you relize how apsent minded you're being?
Tell me ; what happens to the Buddists , The Jews , the hindus , The Athiests and all the other religions?God lets them die a horrable death because we chose to believe somthing other then the christen religion?
Once Jesus comes down from heaven , or whatever , and tells me what you've told me so far , then , and only then I will convert to being Cathlic.
Once I see it I'll believe it.-Judge me all you want , but I still think that if your god ( If Cathlic is the 'true' religion) is so forgiving , and kind ect. he honestly won't condem me to hell for not believing in him.-And the only thing I don't believe is that Jesus is a god ( Off topic ) I still believe that when/if the world comes to an end it wont have anything to do with god rejecting you and leaving you to die ( or what ever ) It'll be due to enviormental issues , war , bombing ect.

[Ives]

Your funny, you probably don't even know what absent minded is because your doing the exact thing your accusing me of, not to metion you didn't spell it right xD

Yes, all them are going to hell because they choose not to believe in God. They denied Him the true praise he deserves, and therefor go to hell. If they have heard about him, and specifically denied him, then that just grants you to the passage to hell. If you can't live with such a simple request, then too bad. It's like choosing not to do your homework, your consequence is getting a lower grade, two choices only, yes or no.

I'm not catholic smart one. Wow, Jesus isn't a God? Their the same damn thing! Didn't I just say educate yourself before talking. I loved your quote before. "We all goto hell because God favors christianity". My friend cracked up, do you really know how uneducated that sounded? Why I am getting a little mean? Because your getting hostile, and the best way is to pick at the persons own stupidity.

That's great you don't believe the world won't end by God. How about you actually start talking about factual stuff, or stuff that at least makes logical sense. I really could care less what you think, it's not hurting me, only yourself. So please next time actually make a valid argument.
I'll get some documents when I have time. (This does not mean I don't have any!)

I'll say one thing about your quote. That quote was made by a human, which you just specifically called stupid. The logic there?

Like I said, humans are stupid and therefore contradict themselves .

[Frizzle]

He's not even that powerful. If he's so powerful how comes he's gonna send down the four horsemen of the apocalypse to destroy and plague the world? Lazy bastard.

[|nfinite]

He's so powerful, he doesn't have to destory the world himself

[cara]

Well AliasXNeo if your beliefs are correct than I guess I'm going to hell.
If that's what I get for what I belive in then heck send me to hell.

EDIT:

But , I think I read in one of your posts that Jesus or whatever will come down fro heaven
and take the Cathlics up into heaven and leave the rest of the world to die , well
what happens after the rest of the world dies?
-Just curious..

Edited by xXxBrok3nxXx, 07 January 2006 - 09:49 AM.

[cara]

Alias Iam not denying God at all.
I belive in god.I'm just not sure that jesus is God.
-And I'm not sure that God will be so 'harsh' twards the other
religions.I belive you will get into heaven by being a good person in
general , no matter what your beliefs are.
Edit:
Anyways , I'm more the person that bases *MOST* of their beliefs on
logic.

Now we're going far off topic so lets end in at that alrighty.

Edited by xXxBrok3nxXx, 07 January 2006 - 10:18 AM.

[Mr. Hobo]

Not sure if this was metion but I'm pretty sure Jesus was and died jewish so wouldn't he have to go to hell according to you?

[Anonehmoose]

Jesus doesn't exist so anything he or the bible (aka what's written inside it) says about the end of the world is false.

I think the world will end with Bush getting pissed off by something and launching a few nukes.

[Mr. Hobo]

If you are born and raised a buhdists and your parents 'brainwashed' you into become a 'hardcore' buhdist and they would hate you if converted according to you you'll go to hell but if you convert you are breaking a commandment which is Honor thy parents so you go to hell, wth.

[Mr. Hobo]

What ever, ignore me. I'd rather not argue over something this pointless, I can't change your views and you can't change mine.

[Sakura]

Yes, Jesus was a Jew, and Judaism is a form of Christianity.

Alias...as a Christian, I'm begging for you to stop this nonsense. You're acting like a fool and very egotistical. The people that read this are being lead to believe that this is what Christianity is, and that all Christians think like you do. It is people like you and these television evangelists that end up ruining any reputation we may have left in the world.
Christianity is about love and acceptance and you are definitely not portraying that.
While wanting to convert them, true, we as Christians are COMMANDED by God to accept unbelievers, homosexuals, adulterers, and even murderers. We are not to judge or decide, that is for God to do.



As for the actual subject, a large portion of the bible is not meant to be taken literally. There are no "horsemen" and no "great beast". I don't think hell is even the fiery place we call it. Hell, is where non believers go to be cast "eternally away from the eyes of God" If anything, the punishment of Hell is the punishment of being left with mobs of people with no morals. This is what we’re living in now anyways. The world will end, and it will be by Gods hand, but it won't be with all of the pretty mythological characters you seem to be expecting. There will be disease and famine and war to wipe out the populations. The tearing down of the church? Symbolism for the spreading lack of faith. Darkness? More symbolism for dwindling morals, perhaps an eclipse will occur. The world itself will be completely destroyed, probably by an asteroid, and then rebuilt becoming the "New Jerusalem". The beast with seven heads, stands for 7 major kingdoms. This makes me think there's going to be a massive war just before the beginning of the end. The Anti-Christ that is spoken of is the next major world leader, the next Hitler, if you will. The trick is, to know what is literal, and what is symbolism, which is even more difficult if you can't read Hebrew.