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Building you own computer?


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#1 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 07:39 PM

OK, so I have decided to really build my own computer. I have the basic knowledge needed and I have dozens of friends at work that have the advanced knowledge needed and they are willing to help me out.

So they question is what to get? Like I said, I know the basics about a lot of things but have no clue about some other things.

I have decided I do want to keep with a AMD Dual core processor. 64 bits of course. But what the CENSORED is a socket on a mother board and shit like that? Is their anywhere you know of that tells you things like that? I have googled it and come back with shit about cars and stuff.

#2 travis

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 07:47 PM

-Dual Core, not Dull core.

A socket is the amount of pins. [or the way it fits in, I'm not sure..] if you get a socket a cpu and a socket c motherboard, your cpu will NOT fit. when you order a cpu online, it will say "AMD 2400+ Dual core socket A" and same for motherboard.

Necessities are a Case, motherboard, CPU, Ram, video card [if you dont care about the shitty onboard then this is optional], hard drive, and cd drive. :p

#3 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 07:52 PM

uh, ya any current dual core AMD is socket 939, so get any socket 939 motherboard i guess, and ALL AMD's released right now use DDR memory, NOT DDR2.. so dont get that confused. Post back if you have more questions :)


Sockets:

AMD:

Socket A
Socket 754
Socket 939 (current)
Socket AM2 (future, will support DDR2)


Intel:

Socket 423
Socket 478
Socket 775 (also called "Socket T") (current)



These are obviously not all of them, just a few of the newest



EDIT:



also, some people wonder why cant you use mobile chips on normal Socket 478 boards, even if they say 478....

like this:


http://www.newegg.co...N82E16819111172

and this:

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16819111180


Its because technically, both of those mobile chips have 478 pins, but the pin positions on them are slightly different, 1 pin is switched around into a slightly new position, if you want to run a mobile chip on a 478 board, you need a ASUS motherboard such as a ASUS P4P800, and a CT-479 adapter kit (costs about 40-50 USD).

Edited by Fatal, 26 March 2006 - 08:06 PM.


#4 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 07:56 PM

Isn't DDR2 the way to go? Isn't it pointless to even get a motherboard that uses just DDR?

#5 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:01 PM

no, DDR2 is still hurting AMD's performance on AM2, For intel, yes DDR2 is much better, but AM2 isnt going to be out for a while, and when it does come out it will be pretty expensive, so eh, if you really need an upgrade, do it now. Intel has been using DDR2 for 1-2 years now, and just now AMD has been pushed to switch, DDR has met the end of its lifespan, memory manufactuers are no longer researching DDR and its reached its limit, therefore we have DDR2, and generally DDR2 is a lot cheaper


personally i think upgrading to an AMD is a terrible idea. Intel is coming out with the "Conroe" which is a processor with an all new design, it beats AMD's FX-60 on an average of like 20%, here are some benchmarks to look at

http://anandtech.com...doc.aspx?i=2713
http://anandtech.com...doc.aspx?i=2716



another reason to get an intel right now, is its already using DDR2, but thats your decision. Intel HAS been in the lead for quite some time now gaming-wise, but if i explained it, you would probably be more confused, so you can AIM me, MSN me, if you really want to know about that

Edited by Fatal, 26 March 2006 - 08:03 PM.


#6 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:05 PM

I actually get what your saying about that.

So you think at this point Intel would be the way to go? How do you go about finding a good processor though? All the Chip Sets I looked at on Newegg are like 500 bucks for one that is better then the one I am currently using. *and you know fatal that its not to good.*

#7 travis

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:06 PM

www.froogle.com

#8 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:11 PM

umm, eh you might as well get a Socket 939 AMD if you're not going to overclock and you want a dual core.. but if you were going to overclock i would for sure get the Intel, no doubt because the new 9xx series intels overclock extremely high, and beat AMD's for the price.. (210-250 dollars)



oh, if you were going to go intel, and you're somewhat on a small budget, I would definetly wait until April 27th because there will be a big price drop on newest intel chips... Im guessing a 920, you can get retail for 190-200, at least thats what im hoping for...but I guess we'll have to wait and see



I just bought a Intel 920 off ebay for 211 dollars, then I used a ebay/paypal coupon which lowered it 21 dollars, so I got a good deal IMO, and im going to probably overclock it to around 4ghz


And you may ask about the 8xx dual core intel chips since they look the same and they're a bit cheaper. The difference between the 8xx and the 9xx series is that the 9xx uses a 65nm process technology, which makes it run cooler and overclock higher. ALL current new AMD's are 90nm , and all 8xx intels are 90nm, Some of the 9xx also has VT (Virtualization Technology)

Virtualization enhanced by Intel Virtualization Technology will allow a platform to run multiple operating systems and applications in independent partitions. With virtualization, one computer system can function as multiple “virtual” systems. With processor and I/O enhancements to Intel’s various platforms, Intel Virtualization Technology can improve the performance and robustness of today’s software-only virtual machine solutions.


Edited by Fatal, 26 March 2006 - 08:15 PM.


#9 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:16 PM

What about the Intel Pentium D's? Are they any good? I mean they are dual core and seem to be pretty pimp with a 3 gig processor already. Yeah money is a issue as always, but I do expect to wait about two months before I order everything.

#10 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:18 PM

all 9xx and 8xx IS pentium D



the D really confuses me because, Pentium D's are always dual core, but with Celeron D's, it just means desktop, so im guessing it always means desktop.... pretty confusing IMO.






Intel 5xx and 6xx = Socket 775, single core but with Hyper Threading and is 90nm
Intel 6x1 = Socket 775, single core, with hyper threading is 65nm

Intel 8xx and 9xx = Socket 775, dual core with NO hyper threading, (8xx is 90nm, 9xx is 65nm)

and all the dual core extreme editions like the 955 and 965 are the same, but have hyper threading

Edited by Fatal, 26 March 2006 - 08:20 PM.


#11 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:23 PM

Ok, I understood the post earlier when you said I wouldn't, but this one....ummm.WTF did you just say?


What about memory. The mother board is compatible to the processor and the memory has to be compatible with the mother board right? So what do you look for in memory. I know that the motherboard I am looking at says it has to be DDR2 800 so I found some of them and it has something under it called

Cas Latency: 4

or

Cas Latency: 5

what does that mean?

#12 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:27 PM

Uh those are the just the latencys, how it does things, but its not extremely important,


oh Intel is very easy once you figure out what to buy, and AMD is always pretty hard, but easy to figure out what to buy


Since intel is confusing motherboard wise, PLEASE link me to the motherboard before you buy, ill make sure everything else your buying is compatible

#13 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:32 PM

I am going to get a few people to check everything out I am going to purchase before I do. First thing is compatibility of course. Next thing is making sure that I have a friend or two who can help me install it all.


Dang it, I am going to have to get windows...*I bet we have a copy laying around Circuit City Somewhere*

#14 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:33 PM

kk, keep me posted :thumbsup: for a much faster responce, PM me :p or IM me with AIM / MSN

#15 Cory

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 08:55 PM

So basically here is what I am thinking so far.

Case ----

ASPIRE X-Plorer ATXB8KLW-AL/420 Black Body/Silver Front Panel Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case 420W Power Supply

Mother Board ----

ABIT AW8 Socket T (LGA 775) Intel 955X ATX Intel Motherboard

Processor ----

Intel Pentium D 830 Smithfield 800MHz FSB LGA 775 Dual Core, EM64T Processor Model BX80551PG3000FN

Memory ----

Patriot Dual Channel 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Unbuffered Dual Channel KIt System Memory Model PDC22G6400LLK

Power Supply ----

POWMAX Demon PSDE580 ATX 580W Power Supply - I didn't know if I should stick with the one that came with the case or not.

Hard Drive ----

Seagate NL35 ST3250623NS 250GB 7200 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM

CD/DVD Drive ----

ASUS Combo Drive Black E-IDE/ATAPI Model CB-5216A BLK - Retail

Video Card ----

XFX GeForce 7900 GT (470MHz) 256MB PV-T71G-UDF7 Video Card - Retail

So I pretty much think I have everything covered. Now I just have to see if they are compatible. So what do y'all think? Also am I missing something?

The end price is around 1210 bucks plus shipping and shit.

So basically it ain't really cheaper then buying a new computer, but I guess for a computer with so many kick ass parts.

#16 Vegas

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 09:25 PM

I don't know much about how the dual core intel CPUs performances are but by the looks of your specs, thats pretty good for the price. I too have been in the business of customizing my comp.

My ratings
Case- Havent really heard of that but most of the time, the Power Supplies that come with cases usually stop working after a while so don't buy it if its too much money. Antec cases that come with PS are usually pretty good I hear.

Motherboard-Not familiar with Intel mobos but make sure it has PCI-Express and SATA compatible.

Cpu-Those dual core Intel procs are nice as they usually are cheaper than the dual core AMDs.

Memory-Haven't really heard much of the Patriot brand(can sum1 clarify its a good brand) Good reliable brands are OCZ,Corsair, Kingston, and Crucial. Make sure your mobo is compatible with 240-pin RAM.

HD-Seagates are the best harddrives period.

Opticals-Good

VidCard-Thats I think a top of the line vid card. I hear its pretty expensive so unless your an extreme gamer with extreme needs, get an 6800GT instead as it is cheaper and still above-decent vid card.

You still need monitor, peripherals-speakers,mouse etc. and maybe a better sound card than the onboard.

Here is my custom comp specs if you wanna have a look.

Attached Files


Edited by Scope, 26 March 2006 - 09:30 PM.


#17 Fatal

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Posted 26 March 2006 - 09:37 PM

few things i forgot to post


A Intel 920 will beat a 820 ,by 2-3% in games at the same speed due to the 920 having 2mb more of cache..

I also HIGHLY DISCOURAGE YOU, from buying that powmax powersupply


taken off EOCF:

Posted Image



i would suggest getting a 400-450w power supply from any of the following brands:



Antec
Enermax
OCZ
Power PC & Cooling
FSP (Fortron)


Iv had a powmax before, and it was terrible




Everything else there is fine, all compatible with each other, except i would much more recommend a ASUS motherboard than a Abit..


http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813131539

^ ASUS P5LD2 945x



If you're going to get conroe in the future, both a 945x and a 955x wont support it anyway, so dont waste too much money on a motherboard



again, i would much rather buy the refurbished version of the P5LD2 since the price is so different (82 dollars)


http://www.newegg.co...82E16813131538R


but i dont know where you live for shipping, so




About the memory Yes Patriot is a good brand, the rest that scope posted are also good brands, i own



Kingston
Crucial
Mushkin
OCZ
Generic crap

Edited by Fatal, 26 March 2006 - 09:48 PM.


#18 Fatal

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Posted 27 March 2006 - 10:52 PM

psh, right now going to AMD as an overclocker would be brain dead... but i guess if hes gonna run bone stock, and not spends thousands and thousands, get an AMD.


AMD's path:

buy processor
buy motherboard
buy DDR memory
buy motherboard
buy DDR2 memory

Intel's path:

buy processor
buy motherboard
buy DDR2



eh, and as i said in a PM to him, overclocking a 920 to 4-4.2 would be great for 210-240 dollar range

#19 Cam

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 12:13 AM

I've got a Thermaltake 430W PSU :)

Its good, came with the case. Awesome case.

Thermaltake Soprano anyway :)

#20 shabba

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 03:14 AM

After just building a comptuer, I went on the baisis of, your never gunna get a spanking new computer.

Components get updated like every 2weeks theres always going to be some thing better when yours is finally built. So I went for an easily upgradable system instead.
I got a AMD64Bit 3700+ CPU which is wicked. Runs at 2.2 could be overclock to 2.5-.6 and still run steady. I went for the 64Bit because in the near future it will the only way.

Memory - I would suggest a minimum of 1GB but 2GB is a better option, this is because alot of new software os coming out that supports 64bit processes and you need alot more memory to run them. Also the Mhz the memory runs at, you dont want less that 130mhz 140+ is probably the best.

Graphics - Now I went for the GeForce 6600 256mb, its alittle old but it still rocks and im not really a gamer so this was all I needed.

HardDrive - I went for a IDE for the moment but my mother board supports SATA, only reason being I got the IDE cheap, 160GB+ is probably the minimum for downloading and crap.

MotherBoard - Now this really does depend on what your looking at I went for a ASUS motherboard just because I like ASUS but Gigabyte is also a good motherboard.

#21 Fatal

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Posted 28 March 2006 - 07:10 AM

erm, i purposly bought an IDE hardrive because


1. they're cheaper + more common
2. they overclock better
3. this board doesnt support RAID anyways, but i guess im going to get a RAID adapter
4. IDE's can be made almost as fast or the same as RAID



Also i discourage anyone from buying the Thermaltake Soprano, i would recommend the Thermaltake Tsunami instead even if it costs a little more, because the Soprano looks almost the same but has a plastic door instead of alluminum.


Thermaltake power supplies are ok.. better then generic cheap ones i guess, but i would still want to upgrade. Iv had 2 thermaltake's die on me so far.

#22 Freddy

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Posted 01 April 2006 - 06:46 PM

whatever you do get just make sure it is right for you cause if you want it for gaming it would be totally different set up than if you get one for programming or databases or even hosting stuff

#23 Freddy

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Posted 03 April 2006 - 07:11 PM

:) its my birthday friday and my stepdad ordered a new video card (nVidia 7800 GS) :D and im sending in my bad stick of ram so i will have twice the ram

#24 Fatal

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Posted 03 April 2006 - 10:50 PM

Brain dead?
AMDs out-clock Intel procs right now. End of story.

Also, you didn't mention that ANY time you upgrade an intel processor; it's pretty much a new chipset... so you need a new mobo.

The current AMD platform (S939) is a relatively high-efficiency; low-cost platform. Overclocking wise, it's phenomenal (Compared to Conroe... meh. Conroe is still 6 months away).

Any AMD processor (S939) overclocked will WIPE THE FLOOR with any equivalent intel (single core) processor. Both overclocked.

I'm talking games here--Photoshop/3DSM; anything that utilized hyper-threading... Intel has a slight edge [The 144s/146s got rid of the extreme edge]. (Single core only..)

Dual Core... AMD no matter what. Hands-down.
Any AMD processor (dual core) will beat the same Intel processor in its price range.
Price-Performance goes to AMD.
Overclockability--again, to AMD.
My current X2 clocks, on STOCK air, [Mind you, this is the crappy HSF--not the 4-heatpipe one], to 2.5Ghz. UNDERVOLTED. 1.28v [Stock is 1.4]
New X2s do this relatively consistently.

Temps load @ 33-35C. Load.
Room ambient is 27C [yes, toasty!]. idle is 33. Load is 44C.
Under water... I'd say it woul be 33/35 (idle/load, respectively).

Yes, that little heat. Efficient bugger.

So, to summarize:
Currently, all of AMDs offerings wipe the floor with the P4s [Yonah is a different matter, but an X2 out performs a Yonah clock-for-clock and is clocked higher--so the X2 has the lead, but isn't smoking it].

Conroe will change all of that. But that's 6 months away.

Price-Performance, Net performance, you name it.
In the single core area; Intel wins if you're using 3DSM/etc; and overclocking HEAVILY. The Opteron 144/146 solidified AMDs lead against Intel on the Single Core overclocking front. 2.6Ghz on stock voltage is typical.

In the dual core area... no competition. At all.

Google for Benchmarks.
Also... don't feed us the "IDE drives overclock better" BS.
You don't overclock your HDD.
You overclock the rest of your system.

Any different it makes is minor.

Also, RAID offers no real-world performance different except with massive data transfer. [Moving Data from one PC to another. Windows load times/etc. aren't helped much, if at all.]
I'll link you to an article if you don't believe me.

--Trevor



lol seriously you need to get hands on experiance with MANY different types of both SATA and IDE. Why do you think you set an AGP/PCI lock, (or i guess PCI/PCI-E lock or whatever if its pci-e) .... it helps your hardrive not get corrupted from overclocking. Also, if you put 4 raptors in raid, you'll get a bigger impact then 2 raptors ;) for 210 dollars i think an intel 920 @ 4ghz is good.. Also conroe is 4-5 monthes away, theres already ES's going around etc, and Meron's can had a bit easier then conroe.



my Presler heat results on a Thermaltake typhoon (air)

about 56F ambient. (13.3c)



Idle: 15c
Load: 30c


Also Yonah is better clock for clock then even the FX60..

http://www.xtremesys...ead.php?t=90743


the reason i dont have my presler @ 4-ish is because my motherboard is owned.. so im going to get an RMA for it after spring break


Almost all somewhat new intels can get 1ghz overclocks, i dont see much of that with AMD's (on air)


Intel 2.4 D1 or m0 @ 3.4... easy..
Intel 2.66B (some of them) - 3.8ghz
Intel 3.0E (almost always 4ghz)
Intel 630 (almost always 4ghz)
and most 640's can hit 4.2...

Edited by Fatal, 03 April 2006 - 10:54 PM.


#25 Cory

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Posted 03 May 2006 - 08:28 PM

So, I am still pushing. This time its graduation time and my mother offered to pay for half the overall cost. So this is what I am looking at. What do y'all think? (is it all compatible)


CD Drive
Cooling System
Case
Hard Drive
Video Card
Power Source
Memory
Mother Board
Processor


I think that I decided in the end to go with a Intel Pentium D 820. Refurb. It runs at 2.8 GHZ and I could probably over clock it to 3.5 according to a few people.

I also decided on a radeon 1600 pro Sapphire video card. Pretty cheap and seems to be well worth it.




After all my quick math, yeah I used a calculator, the price came out to 1001.something. Not bad for what I am getting I guess.


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