184 replies to this topic

[Sweeney]

Okay, I'll explain it through "my" words then. Basically I believe the soul to be the "Breath of life". When man was first created, he was nothing but a pile of flesh and bones. He did not gain life until God breathed the "breath of life" into him. I believe this breath of life to be what we call the soul. It never actually dies, but some people refer the death of the spirit to be going to hell. This spirit is what makes you live, and also some people believe that the last breath a human takes is the soul leaving the body to goto heaven/hell.

There, now that wasn't so bad, was it?
Any chance of an answer to my other question? A simple yes or no will suffice.

So, according to your description of what the soul is and not where it was from, I can still see no reason why Man couldn't have aquired it as a part of a natural progression of evolution...

[Ives]

I thought mormons were Christians, but aren't considered by the mass majority of other denominations? So the brother in christ thing makes sense, in a way.

[Ives]

NO! They are not, come talk to me on MSN, I was talked to the other guy about it and he agreed himself that they were very different.

I was more or less refering to the fact they considered themselves christians for a while, but didnt meet the requirements towards christianity or even as its own religion, mainly because Christians believe God sent his only son jesus to die for human sins. As opposed to mormons, who believe many things different.

[Hawk]

Amyjia, thats some good text. I really should read Revelation some time, that is supposodly a stunning book. Although I am not 100% sure, Im pretty sure it is referring to the end times, not the expulsion of Lucifer from Heaven.

Im horrible at debating religous stuff, Ill just leave it to Alias, he seems good at this. Alias, what are you?

Im a Lutheran

[Ives]

Uhhhhh, I wouldn't say that Alias. but yea

[Ives]

Why not? It makes perfect sense, why would a mormon call a christian "brother"?

I'm refering to the point of them "advertising"

[amyjia]

Amyjia, thats some good text. I really should read Revelation some time, that is supposodly a stunning book. Although I am not 100% sure, Im pretty sure it is referring to the end times, not the expulsion of Lucifer from Heaven.

Im horrible at debating religous stuff, Ill just leave it to Alias, he seems good at this. Alias, what are you?

Im a Lutheran

Yes. Much of Revelation is about "end times", but the part I posted isn't It's about Lucifer and his angels (now known as demons) who got kicked out of Heaven into Earth. Revelation speaks of the Satan going from Heaven to Earth to "mess with" people.. Then it goes into the "end times" talking about the Antichrist and such.

Oh! and if you want to know more about Satan as Lucifer, you can look in Ezekiel 28:11-19. I will quote it from the same King James Translted study Bible. By the way, "King of Tyre was a name used for Satan because there really was a King of Tyre who was controlled by Satan according to the Bible.

"Moreover the word of the Lord came to me, saying "Son of man, take up a lamentation for the king of Tyre, and say to him, 'Thus says the Lord God: "You WERE the seal of perfection, Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty. You were in Eden, the garden of God; Every precious stone WAS your covering: The sardius, topaz, and diamond, Beryl, onyx, and jasper, Sapphire, turquoise, and emerald with gold. The workmanship of your timbrels and pipes Was prepared for you on the day you were created. You WERE the anointed cherub who covers; I established you; You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones. You WERE perfect in your ways from the day you were created, Till iniquity was found in you. By the abudance of your trading You became filled with violence within, And you sinned; Therefore I cast you as a profane thing Out of the mountain of God; And I destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of fiery stones, Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; You corrupted your wisdom for the sake of yourr splendor; I cast you to the ground, I laid you before kings, That they might gaze at you. You defiled your sanctuaries By the multitude of your iniquities, By the iniquity of your trading; Therefore I brought fire from your midst; It devoured you, And I turned you to ashes upon the earth In sight of all who saw you. All who knew you among the peoples are astonished at you; You have become a horror, and SHALL be no more forever."

So Lucifer was a very Beautiful cherub (angel) who's sin was pride.

In this passage, God in essence gives Lucifer the death penalty. That's why in the revelation passage I posted, it says he (Satan) knows his time is short. He is the only "person" who God has already condemned.

Edited by amyjia, 22 April 2006 - 12:39 PM.

[Ives]

Advertising? Mormons are the biggest advertising religion I have ever seen in my life. I am always seeing commercials for mormons, always flyers laying around, it's crazy.

I seemingly, never have. haha

[Hawk]

I seemingly, never have. haha

Mormons are notorious for it. Dont Jehovahs Witnesses do that also Alias?

[Ives]

LOL man. The only time I've ever seen anything to do with mormons on TV was just now. They must not have that many in where I live. Maybe its because I'm in California right now, but meh.

[Will]

Jehovas Witnesses are the door-2-door/on the street people. Mormons are the ones who took over Utah. The TV Evangelists are the ones who want you to send them money.

[redlion]

Hands up if you knew that John smoked opium to induce the dream state in which he got his revelation *raises hand*.

[Ives]

Which John? LOL

[Ives]

Of course, thats one of the many reasons I find it to be complete bogus, but back on topic.

[CaptainPlanetT]

Alias, do you believe that the Earth was created literally, in six days?

Actually, there are many theories regarding creation.

Long-day
and
Short-day happen to be two of them.

Long-day believers think that when the Bible talks about the days of creation it means 1000s of years. ( it says in like one of the the epistles of Peter that 1 day in the house of God is like a 1000 years elsewhere. or something close to that.)

Short-day believers think that the days were actual 24 hour periods.

[Sweeney]

You know what I found funny. I just found out that Mormons believe in the New Testament AS LONG as it applys to their beliefs. In other words, they say the Bible is corrupted, and they must use what's in the book of mormon to decipher what's true and what's been changed in the Bible. What's funny is, there have been nearly 4,000 changes to the original book of mormon ever since it's release:

http://www.bible.ca/...830-changes.htm

So basically they use a book that has been changed nearly 4,000 times to decipher the truth of another book which also has been changed. Wonderful logic.

I'm not saying I agree with Mormonism (?), but in my opinion, is it not better to have beliefs that evolve with the progression of society and circumstance?

[Ives]

I'm not saying I agree with Mormonism (?), but in my opinion, is it not better to have beliefs that evolve with the progression of society and circumstance?

Not quite. Doesn't give the best of name to them.

[amyjia]

I'm not saying I agree with Mormonism (?), but in my opinion, is it not better to have beliefs that evolve with the progression of society and circumstance?

Hmm .. I know what you mean..like when people say "I don't agree with "insert political figure" because they changed their mind about a subject. Does that mean we should only support stubborn people who even after finding evidence that disproves their "belief",they continue to follow it?

Change is a good thing. When people learn more about things, they are suppose to change, like the saying "When you know better, you do better". This is an "Enlightenment" form of thinking.

btw,Thinking that change is bad and that you should stick to tradition and what you have been taught is a "Romantic" form of thinking.

[CaptainPlanetT]

Hmm .. I know what you mean..like when people say "I don't agree with "insert political figure" because they changed their mind about a subject. Does that mean we should only support stubborn people who even after finding evidence that disproves their "belief",they continue to follow it?

Could you please tell us what has disproved Christianity?

[amyjia]

Could you please tell us what has disproved Christianity?

I wasn't saying anything has disproved Christianity. I was just using that as another example of people thinking change = something bad

Edited by amyjia, 25 April 2006 - 03:09 PM.

[emme80]

Jehovahs are all over my neiborhood. with their button up short sleece shirts and the bikes with helmets... aalwaays bothering us...

[Krnsaber]

I saw a video where this guys were hella pissed because of the mormons coming to their door and waking them up every morning. So when they saw them coming they got 2 people with water balloons to come around the back, and the other 2 met them at the door. They started talking and the guys started throwing the balloons at them. Then the "good" mormons started cussing them out and the guy started beating the guy at the door up and the lady even started to kick some of the guys that had the balloons. Great xD

You sound like youre flaming Mormons or making fun of them in that particular video =/

[Cript]

Interesting point you brought up SL64. As a lutheran college student, I know what it's like to have to defend your beliefs against traditional evolutionary teachers with PHDs in whatever who won't accept anything they can't quantify. I actually consider myself an evolutionary creationist as well. I believe that God, in his wisdom, gave the world what it needed to do...well what it needed. While I do not believe that man evolved from apes or anything to that effect (we'll leave that to a different debate), I do believe in evolution when it comes to a survival of the fittest mentality, speaking of why less aggressive, more careful people are the ones that survive and procreate the most. It's hard to explain I guess...I just believe that if there is any form of evolution, then it was allowed for by God at creation. But I absolutely believe that at creation, all species were seperate, and have not evolved from each other. I mean, if we evolved from apes, why are there still apes you know??

[snickpop]

Could you please tell us what has disproved Christianity?

http://www.subrevolt...ettimonster.jpg

Could you please tell us what has disproved the flying spaghetti monster?

Anyway, I like that "long-day / short-day" thing. As if the bible suddenly becomes realistic if it took a 1000 years. I mean if there is a God, why wouldn't he be able to create the universe in 7 days? He's almighty, right? Taking a 1000 year to create the universe is still not credible.

[amyjia]

Anyway, I like that "long-day / short-day" thing. As if the bible suddenly becomes realistic if it took a 1000 years. I mean if there is a God, why wouldn't he be able to create the universe in 7 days? He's almighty, right? Taking a 1000 year to create the universe is still not credible.

Well according to the "long day" explanation, each day would stand for 1000 years. Since the Bible says God created in six days and on the seventh day he rested, that would mean it took him 6000 of our years to create. Another argument some people have made is "If God is almighty, why did he need to rest?" To that, I would say, "The Bible doesn't say God needed to rest. It says that he did rest. God can do whatever God wants to do right? Just because you rest doesn't have to mean you're tired. The Bible says God looked at his work(6 days of work) and saw that it was good, so he rested(7th day). This is supposed to signify how people are supposed to spend their week. The 7th day is reserved for rest(reserved for God) and it doesn't really matter if you are tired or not."