202 replies to this topic

[Frizzle]

Yeah it actually seems to be one of those copy pasters on facebook that idiots use when they have no idea about sociolocal impacts of economics. "Let's pay soldiers what we pay footballers" etc

[Nymh]

How about this viewpoint: Keeping the masses fed and housed (welfare) prevents any sort of successful uprising against those with private property/the government. Take away welfare, or make it so it's unlivable, and there's literally nothing to prevent widespread riots/loss of privately held assets.

 

That said, for my household, there have been times where it would have been more profitable to sit on my ass and collect welfare than to continue working. In Massachusetts, the average family of four on welfare collects more than 50k a year in benefits. At my old job where I worked myself literally to the extreme (physical work at 50-60 hrs a week), I made roughly 34k before taxes, which is 22k post tax, or $5/hr take home (best case scenario). Simply, I took home 2k/month. I was paying $775/mo for rent, around $500 for groceries for the month, banking $725 before gasoline, vehicular expenses, and other expenditures. Student loans take away another $350, and insurance took away another $300 or so (estimated, can't remember tbh). At the end of the month, I have $75 to spend how I please. That's barely enough to make ends meet, never mind get ahead. So yeah, working as hard as I was, in stressful conditions, not really worth it when the alternative is free food, housing, and unlimited free time.

 

My point is thus: We've gotta make it worth it for people to work, rather than just collect, if we want to raise our countries' standard of living. I can't imagine hoe hard it must be for families with children, since it's hard enough with just my wife to support.

 

Where do you live?  We budget $400 a month for groceries, and we have a family of four.

[Frizzle]

To be fair that's dirt cheap. We spend almost $800 a month for a family of four.

[Nymh]

To be fair that's dirt cheap. We spend almost $800 a month for a family of four.

 

Right, and you live in London.  But $500 for one person is still a lot more than $800 for four people.

[Frizzle]

To be fair I live on the outskirts, basically live in Kent (ie a county). I think if someone lived in central city, $500 a month isn't too far fetched.

[cara]

I worked at McDonald's for over three years making minimum wage and still managed to almost fully support myself from the age of 17, in the most expensive province to live in Canada. And let me tell you, it is feasible. It's just a shitty quality of life. But if you work enough hours you can, at least, support yourself. That being said, no, I don't think that's reason enough to raise the minimum wage. The quality of life is poor but I think the tax payer dollars should go towards something a bit more important than the quality of life for those working minimum wage. If you raise the minimum wage inflation will raise everything else with it.

But, I really don't know much about this stuff. Just the opinion of a three year long burger flipper ..

 

To be fair that's dirt cheap. We spend almost $800 a month for a family of four.

 

That is redonculous, and so is 500 a month for groceries. I've been on my own for years and I've never spent more than 200 for myself on groceries a month. And that includes all the crap I eat like junk food. Usually I'll spent like 100-150 at Costco (do you guys have that?) and I'm set for over a month.

[Frizzle]

Four adults > one petite teenager

[cara]

Four adults > one petite teenager

 

Pff I'm not a teenager anymore you old man.

[Frizzle]

I still maintain our upkeep is more than yours because you're sooooo wittle. 

[Batori]

Absolutely. I'm not an expert in this, but I've seen enough projections and reports from people who are that say the economy could accommodate a $15 minimum wage easily--and then people could afford to feed their families on a reasonable workweek.

[Eagles]

Absolutely. I'm not an expert in this, but I've seen enough projections and reports from people who are that say the economy could accommodate a $15 minimum wage easily--and then people could afford to feed their families on a reasonable workweek.

Since these reports and projections are plentiful, where are they?

[masxed]

Whatever gets me more money! $$$   

[NeoVix]

Again, different country, different economy here.

 

Our minimum wage rises often, however only ever by a couple of pence which is an insult to be quite honest. I fully support whats been touted as a 'living wage' which is a significant increase on our current minimum wage. Smaller companies who pay the living wage will get a tax relief..so wont be losing out. larger companies I am not sure if they get a tax relief or not, but its hardly going to affect them really..sorry but when your profit margins are in the billions, you can afford to pay your staff enough for them to live on without having to claim top up benefits.

[shrouded]

ITT: Anecdotal evidence used to defend a low minimum wage because 'I TWERKT HARD U SHULD 2.'

 

Brookings Institute research from 2014

EPI's research from 2013.

CEPR research from 2013

 

I'll spare you all my anecdotal evidence and life story. If you know anything about me great, but I'm not basing my views on anything but research with strong methodology. I'm not posting journalism. I'm not posting OpEds. I saw a comparison between US military and fast food workers. I mean Jesus, how can you even compare that base pay. You get food, housing, and healthcare as an E1. You don't think that has value? People making minimum wage rarely get benefits worth the paper they're written on.

 

In the first paper you can read about the rippling effect to employees who actually make above the minimum wage and their increased wages. The second and third outline some economic impacts. You can find even more information from their references and end-notes. 

 

If you have a low income or you're poor then I can only hope you're using all the resources at your disposal. It's quite difficult to improve your situation, but it can be done. 

[Evangelion]

Increase because most people can't live on minium wage. Just take away some of the money that goes to the military and increase tax on people who make over an x amount of money

[crabsalad]

yes raise it

[Elindoril]

yes raise it

But why? WHY?

[Kaddict]

I think crabsalad didn't care as much about raising minimum wage as he/she did about raising his/her post count

[pancakemachine]

I think they should raise it but not to the extent some people picketing want I mean if you flip hamburgers for a living I can't see you making anything over 10$ an hour and also if they do raise it say I work at a factory where I work my tail off and go home so tired I just go to sleep whats stopping me from going to one of these easier jobs that now have a higher wage and working for them

[Padme]

I think they should raise it but not to the extent some people picketing want I mean if you flip hamburgers for a living I can't see you making anything over 10$ an hour and also if they do raise it say I work at a factory where I work my tail off and go home so tired I just go to sleep whats stopping me from going to one of these easier jobs that now have a higher wage and working for them

 

There's a lot of reasons people choose different jobs. There are people who make less than those at fast food jobs, service industry jobs etc etc because of the stigma around it. 

[Inky]

I don't understand why anyone thinks people shouldn't be paid a living wage for ANY job, including just "flipping burgers." While, yeah, preparing fast food doesn't require a lot of knowledge or training, it's still a job that needs to be filled because people love to feed their diabetes. Anyone who thinks minimum wage shouldn't be raised has never tried to live on it. I'm not saying they should be paid as much as skilled workers, but I think all working people deserve the right to be able to afford to pay their bills.

[Arnau]

The minimum wage was originally created as a way to support a family. The minimum wage has not kept up with inflation and as such no longer can serve that purpose. Increasing the minimum wage would help decrease the amount of people needing government assistance which decreases government spending and increases taxes paid to the government. Happier people results in better workers.

[Swar]

http://www.latimes.c...ory.html#page=1

Go LA!

[untouchablexx]

I think that raising minimum wage brings more money into the economy which helps everyone. It also makes the cost of living go up though, so you never truly win.

[psieks]

Minimum wage was initially intended to be a living wage. As it stands, this would mean that it depends on the cost of living in an area. Areas such as New York and San Francisco have high costs of living, but other areas such as El Paso and Portland have lower costs of living. For this reason, minimum wage should be determined through local legislative bodies rather than at the federal level.