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Rant on 2 Current Events


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#1 bobholly

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 06:02 AM

a couple of things on current events. read and learn, people. im trying to give people the opportunity to stop sounding silly. before i start i couldnt care less who marries who, im all for abolishing marriage so im not on either side.

 

1. marriage is NOT a basic human right, thats such a grossly misinformed statement. marriage comes from the idea that women were property to be sold for a bride price or a dowry, a practice that is still in effect all over the world, even democratic countries like nigeria and india. im sure women who are forced into marriages in countries like saudi arabia would have a very different opinion about the human right label because for them the men are the ones with the rights. if it was a basic human right then there is no excuse for leaving the benefits of that human right away from people who are not and will not be married. see below:

 

2. the people who always want "equality" always have a limited definition of the word. it always means "us" and thats it (for example, show me one speech during the civil rights movement that mentions native americans who are still forced to live on reservations and under harsh, constricting rules. or gay people. MLK in his 'i have a dream' speech, one of many he plagairized btw, only mentions little black boys and girls and little white boys and girls). i have to laugh at the word equality in this instance because in the usa, married people for some unexplainable reason, have 1,138 benefits that single people who never have and never will marry will not get to take advantage of. it was always about the beneifits and the decisions that married people have access to and now another group has it....leaving those who see marriage as a ridiculous custom out in cold. equality? i think not.

 

3. the 'REBEL flag' is what it is called, it was NEVER the confederate flag, again people are grossly misinformed. also, it is not called the 'stars and bars', that was a different flag entirely. maybe this video below should help educate some:
NOT the Confederate Flag

 

and dont say being 'close' is enough. it isnt. spreading misinformation and repeating bumper sticker sized liberal one liners and not researching things for oneself is lazy and sometimes dangerous. one google search on the flag could teach a lot of lazy people a thing or two.

warner bros have banned the 'dukes of hazard' and recalled all the 'general lee' car merchandise because not one person there thought it was a good idea to inform themselves or just didnt have the balls to tell ignorant people that they are just wrong. ‪#‎rantover‬


Edited by bobholly, 27 June 2015 - 06:09 AM.


#2 Adam

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 06:40 AM

Just get married for the benefits (not being serious). I'm never getting married so I guess I never think about the benefits married folks get, I'm gonna have to look that up. Also, you expect the overly politically correct shit heads who whine about everything to actually learn something from a different source other than those overly PC shit heads I mentioned before -- bold move cotton. It's a never ending circle of stupid.

#3 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 06:43 AM

Western marriage is not the same as other marriage practices across the world. Because the definition has changed. Like it just did again. Culture is flexible.

People who disagree with marriage as a custom have the ability to not get married. They also have the ability to reap the benefits bestowed by marriage in a common law relationship. You point is spurious. You list a number of benefits, without examples, but fail to address how they may or may not actually apply to single people.

Working towards universal equality is not an "all-or-nothing" process. It's incremental. You're presenting a logical fallacy by saying that an incomplete solution is not an improvement. You're also doing everyone who believes in equal rights a disservice by implicitly assuming that they can only care about one thing at a time. I can both be glad that the lesbian wedding I'm going to in a month will be recognised by the government, while also being disgusted by the lack of universal healthcare, or the rampant racism we've seen in the past few weeks. I'm also disgusted by forced marriage, and genital mutilation. Among many, many other things.

Finally, I don't give a shit about the Confederate, Rebel or any other flag. Although, I did know that the Rebel flag and the "Stars and bars" are different - I learned that from a news broadcast.

#4 ortin

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:16 AM

Isn't the confederate flag being flown the one flown in battle? Wouldn't that make it even worse?

#5 bobholly

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:38 AM

People who disagree with marriage as a custom have the ability to not get married. They also have the ability to reap the benefits bestowed by marriage in a common law relationship. You point is spurious. 

common law relationships are not the same as marriage lol....and far less recognized than even 'civil unions' were.
but lets say it is for conversation sake.
its ok to tell unmarried people that they can have the same benefits but just under a different label but not alright to tell gay people that they can have the same benefits under the civil union label? now, whos point is spurious? (btw, props to you for the great word!)

also, you didnt seriously expect me to list all 1,138 benefits for you did you?


Isn't the confederate flag being flown the one flown in battle? Wouldn't that make it even worse?

some could argue that case but the point was the endless repeating of inaccuracies needs to stop. it was never the confederate flag.


Edited by bobholly, 27 June 2015 - 07:38 AM.


#6 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:38 AM

common law relationships are not the same as marriage lol....and far much less recognized than even 'civil unions' were.
but lets say it is for conversation sake.
its ok to tell unmarried people that they can have the same benefits but just under a different label but not alright to tell gay people that they can have the same benefits under the civil union label? now, whos point is spurious? (btw, props to you for the great word!)

also, you didnt seriously expect me to list all 1,138 benefits for you did you?


Nice of you to ignore 3/4 of my post.

Tell you what, why don't you pick ten of these benefits, and outline why they should apply to you as a single person.

#7 Nymh

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:42 AM

and dont say being 'close' is enough.


Your video literally ended with "close enough".

#8 bobholly

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:54 AM

the only part i didnt respond to was this:

Working towards universal equality is not an "all-or-nothing" process. It's incremental. You're presenting a logical fallacy by saying that an incomplete solution is not an improvement. You're also doing everyone who believes in equal rights a disservice by implicitly assuming that they can only care about one thing at a time.

so the word equality can be used but...its not REALLY fighting for equality, just equality for one group. im sure the native americans are happy to know someone will fight for them when their turn comes. its a buzz word. they could easily just say they are fighting for the right to be married and recieve the same benefits and have the right to make the same decisions as married people. but activists find action words that invoke pity and empowerment at the same time and equality is a great word for that. but using the word while KNOWING others are being left out and telling them to wait their "incremental" turn is absurd and hypocritical.
and like it or not, we all know there are lots of issues and fighting for only one group under the word equality is exactly caring about one thing at a time. icant stand hearing it just like im sure other groups ive named cant stand hearing it and just like gay people have said many times about the civil rights movement when they had to hear it.
 

as for your newest post, thats what google is for. im not here to write a book for you, educating yourself means taking a piece of what you learn and learning more about it, not asking for someone to feed you information. 

information that you dont want to hear anyway, i can tell by your attitude. you probably already have a line in mind to shoot down whatever i find and link anyway, so i wont try. its YOUR job to learn more.

and thank you too for dodging my points.


Your video literally ended with "close enough".

how did you not hear the sarcasm in his voice?
regardless, close enough is now fact? thats the world we live in? "close enough" gets used too much. obama isnt black but hes "close enough".


Edited by bobholly, 27 June 2015 - 07:58 AM.


#9 Kate

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 07:57 AM

tumblr_nna5xeJO681t9sksvo1_400.gif
 



#10 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:01 AM

the only part i didnt respond to was this:
so the word equality can be used but...its not REALLY fighting for equality, just equality for one group. im sure the native americans are happy to know someone will fight for them when their turn comes. its a buzz word. they could easily just say they are fighting for the right to be married and recieve the same benefits and have the right to make the same decisions as married people. but activists find action words that invoke pity and empowerment at the same time and equality is a great word for that. but using the word while KNOWING others are being left out and telling them to wait their "incremental" turn is absurd and hypocritical.
and like it or not, we all know there are lots of issues and fighting for only one group under the word equality is exactly caring about one thing at a time. icant stand hearing it just like im sure other groups ive named cant stand hearing it and just like gay people have said many times about the civil rights movement when they had to hear it.
 
as for your newest post, thats what google is for. im not here to write a book for you, educating yourself means taking a piece of what you learn and learning more about it, not asking for someone to feed you information. 
information that you dont want to hear anyway, i can tell by your attitude. you probably already have a line in mind to shoot down whatever i find and link anyway, so i wont try. its YOUR job to learn more.

and thank you to for dodging my points.


Nobody is saying "wait your turn" to be fought for. Change happens slowly, and each step in the right direction is a change that should be celebrated, no matter which comes first.

You're telling me to google, but I'm not asking for general information. I'm asking for the top ten benefits that you specifically think you should have as a single person, that are currently only afforded to married couples.

It's entertaining to me that you accuse me of dodging your points, when, as best I can tell, you're not doing a particularly strong job of making any. However, in the interest of completeness, I'll go back and respond to your last "point" again:
 

common law relationships are not the same as marriage lol....and far less recognized than even 'civil unions' were.
but lets say it is for conversation sake.
its ok to tell unmarried people that they can have the same benefits but just under a different label but not alright to tell gay people that they can have the same benefits under the civil union label? now, whos point is spurious? (btw, props to you for the great word!)


I actually wasn't aware of the dismal state of common law relationships in the USA. I come from a more civilised country.
But for the sake of conversation, yes, it is "ok to tell unmarried people that they can have the same benefits but just under a different label but not alright to tell gay people that they can have the same benefits under the civil union label". The reason is this - people who do not agree with marriage do not want to get married. In fact, from what you've said here, you're explicitly asking for the same benefits as married people without getting married. That's not the same as groups who want to get married - the difference seems fairly clear to me.

#11 Swar

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:03 AM

You can't convince someone of something by telling them to google it... lol

#12 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:05 AM

You can't convince someone of something by telling them to google it... lol


I didn't think picking ten out of over a thousand was a terribly big ask =/

#13 Nymh

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:06 AM

It is A confederate flag. While not the only flag they flew, it was a confederate battle flag.

#14 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:08 AM

It is A confederate flag. While not the only flag they flew, it was a confederate battle flag.


Indeed. It's not "the" confederate flag only because there is no such thing as "the" confederate flag.

#15 Swar

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:14 AM

I didn't think picking ten out of over a thousand was a terribly big ask =/

That's too much, I mean, there are only 1138! :rolleyes:



#16 bobholly

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:15 AM

i feel like im devolving this conversation into telling people they cant feel how they feel. thats not what i want. so if i dont respond for a while its only because i think others points of view are important without me getting defensive over each post. but i will be reading.



#17 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:18 AM

i feel like im devolving this conversation into telling people they cant feel how they feel. thats not what i want. so if i dont respond for a while its only because i think others points of view are important without me getting defensive over each post. but i will be reading.


Can't come up with any good ones, eh? That's fine ^_^ Just think about it.

#18 bobholly

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:20 AM

Can't come up with any good ones, eh? That's fine ^_^ Just think about it.

ok now youre just being trollish.
http://www.thesimple...d-cohabitation/

http://www.hrc.org/r...married-couples

http://money.usnews....rement-benefits

enjoy. stop treating me like differences dont exist just because you dont know them and are too lazy to seek the information.


Edited by bobholly, 27 June 2015 - 08:21 AM.


#19 Alexiel

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:34 AM

118djlu.jpg



#20 Adam

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:34 AM

I'm pretty sure Sweeney is genuinely intrigued by what points you can try to make -- I could be wrong though.

#21 KyloRen

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 08:49 AM

I'm pretty sure Sweeney is genuinely intrigued by what points you can try to make -- I could be wrong though.

Maybe it's both? He's intrigued but lazy.



#22 redlion

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 10:27 AM

The onus is on the person positing the point, not the person playing devil's advocate.

The burden is always on the affirmative.

A couple of years ago, this would have been prime redlion bait. But now, I just have to sigh.

#23 Bear

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 12:40 PM

Dang dude, you need to check yo self before you wreck yo self



#24 Kate

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 01:16 PM

Dang dude, you need to check yo self before you wreck yo self

Truer words have never been spoken  :lol2:



#25 Sweeney

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Posted 27 June 2015 - 02:20 PM

ok now youre just being trollish.
http://www.thesimple...d-cohabitation/

http://www.hrc.org/r...married-couples

http://money.usnews....rement-benefits

enjoy. stop treating me like differences dont exist just because you dont know them and are too lazy to seek the information.


I don't think you read my question. I asked for benefits that married people have, that you think single people should have. I don't see how anything in these articles applies to single people at all.


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