41 replies to this topic

[Tammy]

Question is in the title:

Would you feel safer in a country where everybody owns a gun or a country where nobody does?

 

With the obvious exception of law enforcement/military who carry guns in both situations.

 

Edit: Assuming that it is an entirely random population with people from all walks of life. There is no set "type" of person in these countries, everyone is different, just like in real life.

Edited by Tammy, 28 May 2016 - 02:50 PM.

[Katya]

You can't reduce a debate like this to only two options, since the problem are the people and not the guns.
What kind of people would live in each country?

[Tammy]

You can't reduce a debate like this to only two options, since the problem are the people and not the guns.
What kind of people live in each country?

 

A huge variety of people, like in any modern country. There's no set "type" of people, it's not all good people or bad people or christians or whatever. Just a random sample of people who could be anything.

[Dewgong]

You can't reduce a debate like this to only two options, since the problem are the people and not the guns.
What kind of people would live in each country?

 

I totally agree. The people are definitely the problem, not the guns.

[Adam]

I'd feel much safer in a country with no guns at all except for the...exceptions. I have a few guns myself only for personal defense reasons, no one should have to fear being shot when they step out of their house.

[KaibaSama]

I could see it now: 

The last *random item*

"I want it!"

"No it's mine!"
*pulls out gun*

*2nd person pulls out larger gun*

and so on until someone gets shot.

 

I agree with the people being the issue. If I have to choose, I'd prefer to live somewhere where no one has a gun. 

[Katya]

Then my answer is obvious: nobody. We can't trust humans.


@KyloRen that's the reality in so many places.

[Tammy]

I'd feel much safer in a country with no guns at all except for the...exceptions. I have a few guns myself only for personal defense reasons, no one should have to fear being shot when they step out of their house.

 

Would you be comfortable giving up your guns if you knew that every other civilian in your country would also be giving up theirs?

[Adam]

Would you be comfortable giving up your guns if you knew that every other civilian in your country would also be giving up theirs?

I'd give them up if the government paid me for them. But otherwise, yes.

[meody]

No guns at all because, not everyone is a reasonable human being with normal judgment and I wouldnt feel safe knowing every crazy person had one.

[Kaddict]

The problem with this argument is that the second amendment (for you US people) is not about people being able to own guns to protect themselves from home intruders, or for hunting or anything. The guns are to protect yourself from the government. That is what everyone forgets when we discuss this.

[Salade]

But in what kind of country do you live if you have to protect yourself from your own government? Or is that the point I'm missing?

 

 

I live in a European country of which it seems to be a common misconception that we all carry guns on us at all times. I have no idea where that notion came from. It is true that our soldiers are allowed to take their guns home, but they are under very strict regulations. Shitty accidents do happen, a girl was shot quite near where I live. Scary scary, because the murderer was a soldier on his leave for the weekend.

 

Aaanyways, I do feel very safe in my country where some people have guns at home, you need a special license to be able to carry it in public, and that is handed out rarely if at all. I get squeamish af whenever I see a soldier with his rifle just sitting on public transport. You never know how well they hide their looniness. One day they might just snap.

[Coops]

I live in a state with open carry and it makes me far more nervous here than it did when I lived in AK. At least, in AK, you have people who carry to protect themselves from wildlife like bears and moose, which can be very dangerous. But here, I'm mostly worried about drunk people or overzealous do-gooders who will accidentally shoot the wrong person, which has happened.. I'm worried about domestic situations where an abuser has a gun. I live in a super shady neighborhood and I would not carry a gun around because if I were disarmed, I'd be in a lot of danger. But guns are tools. So, I don't have an issue with guns, just have an issue with people. 

[Junjie]

I actually live in a country where no one except policemen (whose gun usage are strictly regulated too) have guns. I and everybody else feel pretty safe. But that's partly got to do with the country itself being safe however. If a place and people aren't safe, they might not be safe even without guns I'm suspecting (though of course, such people having guns would make them much less safe-feeling lolol).

[Romy]

As long as people are responsible, I have no qualms living in a country where people have guns.

Guns are not only used to kill people. Guns are used for self-defense, hunting and even sporting competitions.

 

If I had to choose between the two, I'd choose to live in a country where every responsible adult has access to a firearm. How do we decide which adult is responsible? Through testing (written and shooting).

 

Emotional/Psychological issues? No Gun

Criminal History? No Gun

[wikkles]

http://qz.com/688447...me-in-the-face/

 

Great op-ed article that everyone should read.

[Coops]

As long as people are responsible, I have no qualms living in a country where people have guns.

Guns are not only used to kill people. Guns are used for self-defense, hunting and even sporting competitions.

 

If I had to choose between the two, I'd choose to live in a country where every responsible adult has access to a firearm. How do we decide which adult is responsible? Through testing (written and shooting).

 

Emotional/Psychological issues? No Gun

Criminal History? No Gun

So anyone with depression isn't allowed to have a gun? That's a pretty slippery slope, imo. I appreciate the sentiment and I can definitely agree there are some people with psychological issues who shouldn't have a gun, but I think without context, just saying "emotional/psychological issues / no gun" is dumb.

[Romy]

So anyone with depression isn't allowed to have a gun? That's a pretty slippery slope, imo. I appreciate the sentiment and I can definitely agree there are some people with psychological issues who shouldn't have a gun, but I think without context, just saying "emotional/psychological issues / no gun" is dumb.

Yes. A person diagnosed with depression should not be allowed to have a gun.

How is it a slippery slope? 

[Kitty]

Humans.. and guns or people in guns I have sorta hate and love for this topic.

 

1) I'm bit of a hill billy not to be confused with "Red neck" And I dont hunt myself but I do love myself some jerky and meats.

2) So many shootings lately I think some days it doesn't even matter if you need A GUN license, people will find a way to get guns.

 

So people.

[Coops]

Yes. A person diagnosed with depression should not be allowed to have a gun.

How is it a slippery slope? 

So all depressed people should never be allowed to hunt or have a gun for self-defense? But everyone else, okay? It's a slippery slope because not all depressed people use guns for nefarious reasons, or to hurt themselves and by limiting it with a zero tolerance policy is assuming that will inevitably happen. It's not right to limit the rights of some, just because they suffer from depression, especially given a large proportion of the world suffers from depression. This nation does a fantastic job of stigmatizing mental illness and this is just another shitty example of that, imo.

[Romy]

So all depressed people should never be allowed to hunt or have a gun for self-defense? But everyone else, okay? It's a slippery slope because not all depressed people use guns for nefarious reasons, or to hurt themselves and by limiting it with a zero tolerance policy is assuming that will inevitably happen. It's not right to limit the rights of some, just because they suffer from depression, especially given a large proportion of the world suffers from depression. This nation does a fantastic job of stigmatizing mental illness and this is just another shitty example of that, imo.

Statistically speaking, depressed people with firearms are more likely to commit suicide using the firearm than using other methods.

Owning a firearm does not increase the likelihood that someone will commit suicide BUT it will result in a higher success rate than someone not using a firearm.

 

Gun-related suicide accounts for 1.3% of non-lethal suicide attempts. On the other hand, 13.3% of successful suicide attempts were gun related.

 

 

If using these statistics means I'm stigmatizing mental health, so be it.

Once again, people diagnosed with depression should NOT be allowed to own a firearm.

 

I would like to hear any counter argument you have however.

[Coops]

Statistically speaking, depressed people with firearms are more likely to commit suicide using the firearm than using other methods.

Owning a firearm does not increase the likelihood that someone will commit suicide BUT it will result in a higher success rate than someone not using a firearm.

 

Gun-related suicide accounts for 1.3% of non-lethal suicide attempts. On the other hand, 13.3% of successful suicide attempts were gun related.

 

 

If using these statistics means I'm stigmatizing mental health, so be it.

Once again, people diagnosed with depression should NOT be allowed to own a firearm.

 

I would like to hear any counter argument you have however.

I was worried you were going to mention gun related homicides, so I'm glad you didn't go there, because that's what I meant when I said stigmatizing mental illness, specifically depressed people. I was thinking about mass shootings and gun violence against other people, versus suicides mostly. The US media has a problem with painting all mass shooters as mentally ill, without any context.

 

I'd have to really consider it before I could counter argue the context you gave me. But again, I'm really glad you specified what you meant, because as I said above, without context your post seemed dumb to me. With context, I can see where you're coming from and it makes sense logically why you'd be against it. Give me time to mull it over in my mind a bit and I'll respond.

[Romy]

I was worried you were going to mention gun related homicides, so I'm glad you didn't go there, because that's what I meant when I said stigmatizing mental illness, specifically depressed people. I was thinking about mass shootings and gun violence against other people, versus suicides mostly. The US media has a problem with painting all mass shooters as mentally ill, without any context.

 

I'd have to really consider it before I could counter argue the context you gave me. But again, I'm really glad you specified what you meant, because as I said above, without context your post seemed dumb to me. With context, I can see where you're coming from and it makes sense logically why you'd be against it. Give me time to mull it over in my mind a bit and I'll respond.

My personal viewpoints on mass-shootings and homicides differ but I'm much more worried about self-harm than the opposite.

I apologize for not specifying initially. I realize that leaving it ambiguous like that wasn't the best thing to do.

[Tammy]

I don't think anyone has ever said people are not the problem, people are very clearly the problem. No one thinks that a gun will just start up and shooting people on it's own.

 

The thing is though that no amount of legislature can change peoples innate nature, and making these tools so freely available to you for frivolous things like "self defense" or "hunting sport" also makes them freely available to other, less reasonable, and more dangerous people around you.

 

When weapons are so easily accessed even if you need to pass a test or whatever that doesn't stop a troubled teenager from stealing his "perfectly reasonable" fathers gun and shooting up a school. His father doesn't NEED a gun, giving him access to one is a risk. Giving ANYONE access to guns is a risk. People are fragile and volatile and unpredictable.

[diebuster]

It depends if there is civil unrest, the overall crime rate and whether I'm living in a country where neighbouring countries are itching to invade. Right now I'm doing fine living in a place where nobody owns any guns.