64 replies to this topic

[NapisaurusRex]

Oh I guess I must of missed the last decade of fighting then?

I did, apparently.

[Speedracer]

An independent, UNHRC-operated fact-finding mission found it to be Israeli government policy to target civilians.

 

And last night Israel bombed a UN-operated school that was being used to house refugees, killing dozens in their sleep. There's no excuse for that. Period.

Not excusing it, but context helps

• Religion has little to do with the conflict, idk why he's going out of his way to whine about the Bible being "sickening"
• *aggressively ignores the fact that Israel is located on land that belonged to Palestine before 1948*

Religion has a fair amount to do with the conflict, Hamas wants to destroy the state of Israel and turn it into a caliphate, just read their charter
http://dailycaller.c...om-its-charter/

 

There was not previously a state of Palestine at best they are contested territories
https://www.youtube....GYxLWUKwWo#t=41

[Bone]

Not excusing it, but context helps

Religion has a fair amount to do with the conflict, Hamas wants to destroy the state of Israel and turn it into a caliphate, just read their charter
http://dailycaller.c...om-its-charter/

 

There was not previously a state of Palestine at best they are contested territories
https://www.youtube....GYxLWUKwWo#t=41

 

I'm referring to a separate incident, not one from the 22nd. http://www.reuters.c...N0FV04A20140730

 

I don't think anyone is denying or defending the antisemitic rhetoric in Hamas' charter. But it would be to ignore the massively more influential context to claim that pure antisemitism is the source of Hamas' violence against Israel. Israel's direct and ruthless military aggression and economic stranglehold fuel the flames of anti-Israeli sentiment and retaliation in Gaza. The election and rise of Hamas can be directly linked to Israel's occupation and subsequent degradation of living conditions in Israel. The fact that they're bombing beaches and marketplaces certainly can't help. I don't blame Gazans for their desperation.

 

State =/= nation. My least favorite Zionist myth is that there was/is no Palestinian identity or culture.

[HiMyNameIsNick]

We all agree that the true terrorist side in here is Israel, right?

Killing people in schools and even hospitals... not even in the WWII people went that far.

[Fikri]

israel accusses malaysia for training hamas militants. lolwut.

[NapisaurusRex]

We all agree that the true terrorist side in here is Israel, right?

Killing people in schools and even hospitals... not even in the WWII people went that far.

Yes, they did. Sandhurst School, St Bartholemew's Hospital, Nagasaski, a lot of inner Dresden...

[N2Jargon]

We all agree that the true terrorist side in here is Israel, right?

Killing people in schools and even hospitals... not even in the WWII people went that far.

It definitely doesn't appear to be the overall view, seems half and half.

[Bone]

Gaza school attack denounced as 'criminal act' by UN chief.

 

 

 

A deadly attack on a school in the city of Rafah in the south of Gaza has been denounced as a "moral outrage" and "criminal act" by the UN secretary general, Ban Ki-moon.

At least 10 people were killed and dozens more wounded after a projectile struck a street outside the school gates on Sunday morning.

The school was sheltering more than 3,000 people displaced by fighting in the area. It has been the scene of heavy bombardment by the Israeli military and fierce clashes following the suspected capture by Hamas fighters of an Israeli soldier, later declared killed in action.

In a statement, Ban called on those responsible for the "gross violation of international humanitarian law" to be held accountable. He said the "Israel Defence Forces (IDF) have been repeatedly informed of the location of these sites."

[Josh]

I'd be pissed if someone was shooting rockets at my house lol.

[redlion]

We all agree that the true terrorist side in here is Israel, right?
Killing people in schools and even hospitals... not even in the WWII people went that far.

As Napiform alluded to, WWII was essentially a total war. This type of war is characterized by a blurring of the line between combatant and non-combatant. The twin bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki are excellent examples of this blurring, as are the bombings of Coventry and Dresden. Further examples would be the targeting of civilian shipping, the use of POWs as slave labor, etc. Kurt Vonnegut's book Slaughterhouse Five deals extensively with the author's experiences in Dresden.

But that happened seventy years ago, and since that time the international community has developed laws of warfare (most notably the Geneva Conventions) that deal with these issues. While Israel may be in a state of constant readiness to engage in total war, the same cannot be said for the Palestinians, most of whom live in poverty.

I'd be pissed if someone was shooting rockets at my house lol.

Would you be pissed if your freedom of movement was restricted to a 32x7 mile rectangle with no power and no clean water?

[Josh]

Would you be pissed if your freedom of movement was restricted to a 32x7 mile rectangle with no power and no clean water?

 

Yep, but I also wouldn't be stupid enough to resolve my issues by shooting rockets at a neighbor with clearly more superior military power and then use my own family to take the blunt of the retaliation. 

[redlion]

Yep, but I also wouldn't be stupid enough to resolve my issues by shooting rockets at a neighbor with clearly more superior military power and then use my own family to take the blunt of the retaliation.

Walk a mile in their shoes. Is it stupid to try to fight for one's rights? These people see themselves as ethnically, culturally and politically distinct, and yet they have none of the rights that other such nations enjoy. Who are you to say what is stupid for them to do in pursuit of such freedoms?

Regardless, I don't think the majority are firing rockets. I think it's a very small minority. Yet the whole population is shelled, restricted and embargoed. You're generalizing.

[Josh]

Walk a mile in their shoes. Is it stupid to try to fight for one's rights? These people see themselves as ethnically, culturally and politically distinct, and yet they have none of the rights that other such nations enjoy. Who are you to say what is stupid for them to do in pursuit of such freedoms?

Regardless, I don't think the majority are firing rockets. I think it's a very small minority. Yet the whole population is shelled, restricted and embargoed. You're generalizing.

 

I never said any words on their behalf. I merely stated my rather meaningless opinion on the matter at hand along with the rest of the participants in this discussion. I know it's been awhile, but you should remember that I tend to refrain from speaking in absolutes. 

[evoheyax]

The Israeli military is nothing more than another group of U.S. trained and funded terrorists. Zionism is a scary thing, and your seeing however the Zionists control the U.S. and in a sense, the world.

[Bone]

The Israeli military is nothing more than another group of U.S. trained and funded terrorists. Zionism is a scary thing, and your seeing however the Zionists control the U.S. and in a sense, the world.

 

Well...no.