70 replies to this topic

[Ali]

Not being funny but id rather see a few pubs close than some innocent people get illnesses from breathing in smoke they didnt want to.

Its a shame they they have lost business of course but i do remember a time that i was in the minority of non smokers in my social group and when the others used to go off the the other room to smoke they would be in there alot longer than when they have to go outside now, so now i have more time with my friends and no smoke to irriate me, win win in my oppinion.

And Yep! The UK have banned smoking in any public indoor place, weather it be pubs resturants and all work places.

It's quite a lot more than "a few pubs" though. More like a few every day. Plus of course, knock on effects to breweries, suppliers etc. And it's nice pubs that I quite enjoy being in, rather than a crappy Wetherspoons here and there.


Anyway, I don't mind the smoking ban, I've met some nice people chatting in the smoking area who I wouldn't know otherwise. In fact because of that I probably smoke more now than before the ban, instead of going out for one, you end up talking to somebody new and having a couple. Friends who don't smoke come out with us so they can carry on conversations and not sit inside with coats/bags/drinks etc so that makes the ban rather pointless for them. It's a lot nicer from a working perspective though, I'll grant you that, working a long bar shift is sliiiightly less unpleasant when you come home not smelling of smoke.

We probably do go out slightly less now though. If it's cold and/or raining (so...most days) it can seem a better idea just to all be at a house rather than traipsing to pubs/clubs only to spend a large amount of time outside it.

[Metigue]

I think we should go further and ban smoking altogether I realise it's an addiction and that some people "can't quit" but if it became illegal it would help atleast 50% of the population quit.

My Mother is a heavy smoker, and I've seen the effects it's had on her. It's such a horrible poison.

[jcrdude]

I think we should go further and ban smoking altogether I realise it's an addiction and that some people "can't quit" but if it became illegal it would help atleast 50% of the population quit.

My Mother is a heavy smoker, and I've seen the effects it's had on her. It's such a horrible poison.

Fallacy: Making something illegal makes people stop doing it

Really you just increase the quantity of petty criminals when you do this.

[Metigue]

I never said making something illegal stops people from doing it, I said I realise it's an addiction for some and they will carry on doing it illegaly, but some people will stop if it is made illegal. It also adds some reason to people stopping smoking, because some people like my mother see it as eating chocolate, "It's bad for you but, ohwell"

[Oaken]

I don't want to breathe in your car's exhaust but I do it any way and I don't fucking complain or tell you where you can and can't drive. What gives you the right to dictate my actions because it makes you marginally uncomfortable?

Driving a car is a necessity for a lot of people...whereas there is no legitimate reason for smoking. You could give some shit excuse like it relieves stress....so does sport and many other things that won't affect your health or anyone elses. It's a sociable thing....so is not smoking while you talk, drink etc.

Also, what gives you the fucking right to make me marginally uncomfortable?

[Ashlee]

We have bans in most of the Australian states. Our hospital recently imposed a ban to stop people smoking at the entrance to the hospital. I also found it quite rude that people would smoke there anyway, especially when you have sick people entering and exiting, not to mention babies. I do think entire bans are a bit extreme, smokers should still be allowed to go out and kill themselves slowly if they like but at the same time, non-smokers shouldn't have to sit through a meal with smoke wafting over to their table.

I think the best option is designated smoking areas (not necessarily outside) where those who smoke/don't mind it can sit.

[jcrdude]

Also, what gives you the fucking right to make me marginally uncomfortable?

If you don't like something about a restaurant or bar, you have 2 logical options.

1. Stop going to that restaurant/bar
2. Complain to the manager/owner about it.

If enough people complain/leave... things will change. That's the way this shit should work on a matter of what a bar/restaurant does and does not allow within their walls.

At least that's the way things USED to work before the world decided to roll over and become a whiny bitch.

Now an owner can't tell you to fuck-off with your dumbass idea because now the government is telling them that for some reason the whiner outweighs the people inside not whining.

I mean seriously. Quit crying to mummy and daddy and grow the fuck up and learn how to deal with people right.

[Eskimo]

Driving a car is a necessity for a lot of people...

That's false, they just won't be inconvenienced to walk/bike or use public transportation.

Also, what gives you the fucking right to make me marginally uncomfortable?

Absolutely nothing. Nothing gives me the right, however there is no law telling you to stand by a smoker.

[Bryan]

That's false, they just won't be inconvenienced to walk/bike or use public transportation.


Absolutely nothing. Nothing gives me the right, however there is no law telling you to stand by a smoker.

It's necessary in the United States, where there is not always public transportation.

[Eskimo]

<br />It's necessary in the United States, where there is not always public transportation.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

It might be more difficult, I admit the US infrastructure is shit compared to most of the world. In some cities they make it hard to even walk: I've lived in cities where side walks are sparse and there's no cross walk buttons. But that is far from an excuse, as shitty as the bus system is, I take them often and there's always the option of car pooling. The job my wife has even rewards their employees for car pooling. Of course you can always cancel your gym membership and start biking.

[Oaken]

I mean seriously. Quit crying to mummy and daddy and grow the fuck up and learn how to deal with people right.

Maybe you should learn that not every conversation/topic requires your input. I was talking to Eskimo, not you. If you had read his post and then mine then you would see that I was perfectly within my rights to talk the way I did.

Also, you don't know me and until you do don't generalize my actions. Just because I said something in a certain way once does not mean I talk or act that way to everyone.

Oh and telling me to grow up by replying the way you did makes you a hypocrite. You may want to take your own advice.

That's false, they just won't be inconvenienced to walk/bike or use public transportation.


Absolutely nothing. Nothing gives me the right, however there is no law telling you to stand by a smoker.

If you live in a small town or village and you want to earn good money then you have to commute. Depending on access etc then it may well be a necessity, as it will be for me whenI start my new job. It's also entirely possible that you need to commute and you also require your car to do your job.

Edited by Oaken, 18 October 2009 - 06:25 AM.

[pyke]

Smoking's bad m'kay?

In all seriousness, I don't think it should be a huge deal really.

[jcrdude]

Maybe you should learn that not every conversation/topic requires your input. I was talking to Eskimo, not you. If you had read his post and then mine then you would see that I was perfectly within my rights to talk the way I did.

Also, you don't know me and until you do don't generalize my actions. Just because I said something in a certain way once does not mean I talk or act that way to everyone.

Oh and telling me to grow up by replying the way you did makes you a hypocrite. You may want to take your own advice.

1. It's a nice open forum.

2. Because I quoted you doesn't mean I was necessarily talking to you either. Your specific sentence developed a rant against people in general not specifically against you.

3. Again, was not trying to infer anything about you. I'm pissed off about the way that society has developed.

4. I've had lots of experience dealing with people who "go running to mummy and daddy" (in this case the government)... and in any other approach but direct verbal confrontation telling them to "grow the fuck up and learn how to deal with people right" either leads to being ignored or having them off to mummy and daddy on you again.

I didn't mean it to be an attack against you. I was tired and pissed at society.

I apologize if it came off as a personal attack.

[Bryan]

<br /><br /><br />

It might be more difficult, I admit the US infrastructure is shit compared to most of the world. In some cities they make it hard to even walk: I've lived in cities where side walks are sparse and there's no cross walk buttons. But that is far from an excuse, as shitty as the bus system is, I take them often and there's always the option of car pooling. The job my wife has even rewards their employees for car pooling. Of course you can always cancel your gym membership and start biking.

No, you don't understand. I have family that commutes 2 hours to work. You're telling me they need to bike for 50 miles or take a nonexistent bus alongside a mountain? Cars are necessities for some, smoking is not.

Edited by Bryan, 18 October 2009 - 04:26 PM.

[Georgina]

What illnesses? Can anyone find a conclusive study on cigarette smoking's adverse health risks other than a hacking caugh? Even the study the Surgeon General uses to justify the warnings performed by the FDA found ridiculously low figures: it wasn't until inconvenienced, ignorant pricks decided to spin it that it was cited. Take those rediculously low figures, and tell me how many people are really effected by second hand smoke. Virtually none, that's how many. But people think their clothes stinking is justification enough. Compare those numbers to the rates of skin cancers because the same inconvenienced assholes wanted to spray their CFCs, or the number of cancers caused by PFOAs because the same inconvenienced assholes are too lazy to clean their damn pots and pans. How about cancers caused by the heavy metals used by dentists? The list goes on and on. So many products designed for consumer convenience fuck the earth and the human population and consumers use smoking as a scapegoat because they don't like the smell.

Erm yes? loads!

Anyway if there were a public vote im sure over 50% of people would uphold the ban.

Its not just about clothes smelling as i mentioned in my first post, i (among millions of other people) wear contact lenses and there were points where i would have to close my eyes as the smoke hurt them so much.

I totaly see your point but it is the smokers decision to light up, not the people around them, so why should we have to move when its your choice?

[luvsmyncis]

I think we should go further and ban smoking altogether I realise it's an addiction and that some people "can't quit" but if it became illegal it would help atleast 50% of the population quit.

My Mother is a heavy smoker, and I've seen the effects it's had on her. It's such a horrible poison.

Sorry to hear about that.

I can think of no real reason for people to smoke, other than personal enjoyment, but just because there's no reason for doing something doesn't mean people shouldn't BE ALLOWED to do it. I can understand a ban that prevents non-smokers from being effected by cigarette smoke, but banning it altogether is like saying, "Hey, the sun causes cancer, and there's no real reason to be sitting in the sun other than personal enjoyment... New Law: no one shall be allowed to lay out on the beach."

[Eskimo]

<br />No, you don't understand. I have family that commutes 2 hours to work. You're telling me they need to bike for 50 miles or take a nonexistent bus alongside a mountain? Cars are necessities for some, smoking is not.<br />

<br /><br /><br /> Then your family are pricks. Kyoto protocol or you have no moral ground.

<br />Erm yes? loads! <br /><br />Anyway if there were a public vote im sure over 50% of people would uphold the ban.<br /><br />Its not just about clothes smelling as i mentioned in my first post, i (among millions of other people) wear contact lenses and there were points where i would have to close my eyes as the smoke hurt them so much. <br /><br />I totaly see your point but it is the smokers decision to light up, not the people around them, so why should we have to move when its your choice?<br />

<br /><br /><br />Loads of what? Conclusive studies? Can you cite any? I don't smoke and I grew up with smoking parents, so &quot;My eyes hurt!&quot; means nothing to me, however you're missing the point. If there can't be a law to say you must move away from a smoker, then there can't be a law that says a smoker must move away from you. You can make that choice, and the smoker can make that choice(I emphasize the word choice), but the choice should never be made by anyone else for either person.

<br />Sorry to hear about that.<br /><br />I can think of no real reason for people to smoke, other than personal enjoyment, but just because there's no reason for doing something doesn't mean people shouldn't BE ALLOWED to do it. I can understand a ban that prevents non-smokers from being effected by cigarette smoke, but banning it altogether is like saying, &quot;Hey, the sun causes cancer, and there's no real reason to be sitting in the sun other than personal enjoyment... New Law: no one shall be allowed to lay out on the beach.&quot;<br />

<br /><br /><br />I don't agree with everything you're saying but that last part was pure gold. +rep for that.

Edited by Eskimo, 20 October 2009 - 03:06 PM.

[ArticTheTiger]

Reading this thread's title I realised I will probably die because my father smokes.

[Oaken]

Then your family are pricks.

Asshole

Edited by Oaken, 20 October 2009 - 03:11 PM.

[Eskimo]

Asshole

Elaborate plz.

[Oaken]

Elaborate plz.

Why are you insulting his family? The point Bryan made is inarguable....that is just the world we live in. It's the people who drive around the corner to the shop that your comment applies to not the people who need to travel a long distance to make a living.

[Eskimo]

Why are you insulting his family? The point Bryan made is inarguable....that is just the world we live in. It's the people who drive around the corner to the shop that your comment applies to not the people who need to travel a long distance to make a living.

I suppose flying hundreds of thousands of miles a year, burning countless gallons of jet fuel, for discussion that could just as easily have occurred over the phone is all right as well because that's just the world we live in. Eff that. The damning effects of commutes like this, unlike cigarette smoke, are well understood. If you're going to attack cigarette smoking, unnecessary public health blights like this ought to be taken care of first as they dwarf the effects of second hand smoke. You can't attack one without the other. And don't pretend that such a commute is necessary as plenty of people work from home.

[Oaken]

I suppose flying hundreds of thousands of miles a year, burning countless gallons of jet fuel, for discussion that could just as easily have occurred over the phone is all right as well because that's just the world we live in. Eff that. The damning effects of commutes like this, unlike cigarette smoke, are well understood. If you're going to attack cigarette smoking, unnecessary public health blights like this ought to be taken care of first as they dwarf the effects of second hand smoke. You can't attack one without the other. And don't pretend that such a commute is necessary as plenty of people work from home.

The average person does not do any of that....and that's what we are, the average person. So stop preaching that shit to us. You have a problem with a problem with people jetting around the world for mettings etc fine....but that is a tiny amount of people. We can't do anything about that but the fact is people need to travel to work. I am starting a job as a police officer in about 6 months time and I will need to travel about 100 miles every day by car to do it. I don't have a choice, simple as that.

I agree with you about the business trips, they are unecessary in many cases. Smoking is unecessary as well, it has no physical benefit at all....in fact...you can't moan about the pollution from flying etc causing ill health and then stick a cigarette in your mouth. That makes you a hypocrite.

You could say that I can't moan about smoking and then drive around in a car...but at least there is a point to it.

[Eskimo]

The average person does not do any of that....and that's what we are, the average person.

The average person doesn't pollute the ait excessively? lolol.

So stop preaching that shit to us.

It's just as reasonable to preach that as it is to preach anti-smoking. More so even.

I am starting a job as a police officer in about 6 months time and I will need to travel about 100 miles every day by car to do it. I don't have a choice, simple as that.

You do. It's called "don't."

Smoking is unecessary as well, it has no physical benefit at all....in fact...you can't moan about the pollution from flying etc causing ill health and then stick a cigarette in your mouth.

I don't smoke.

You could say that I can't moan about smoking and then drive around in a car...but at least there is a point to it.

Letting the ends justify the means when the means are terrible and the ends are simply your comfort is terrible.

[Frizzle]

I am starting a job as a police officer in about 6 months time and I will need to travel about 100 miles every day by car to do it. I don't have a choice, simple as that.

lol wut? Is there even a county that big? Transfer?

PC or PCSO?