And I therefore have the right to voice my disgust with your calling religious people the scum of the earth.
And I acknowledge your disgust
Posted 11 June 2011 - 07:07 PM
And I therefore have the right to voice my disgust with your calling religious people the scum of the earth.
Posted 13 June 2011 - 08:43 AM
Posted 14 June 2011 - 11:19 AM
Posted 14 June 2011 - 06:09 PM
Well I have better justification for my beliefs (which i've probably stated in some other thread regarding religion) and as long as I'm on the secular end of the spectrum I'll be fine
Posted 14 June 2011 - 07:21 PM
Posted 14 June 2011 - 09:35 PM
You do know the horseshoe theory right? The more extreme the closer you become to the opposite end of the spectrum due to similarities.
Basically, you are what you hate. Congratulations.
Posted 15 June 2011 - 02:32 PM
Posted 15 June 2011 - 03:17 PM
It's been tested plenty of times.
I recall a particular study where the group that were being prayed for, but didn't know it, endured a lower rate of recovery than those that weren't, as well as those that were and knew it.
Statistically insignificant, but still an amusing result.
Posted 17 June 2011 - 11:00 PM
Thank you for basically reposting exactly what I said.In the largest study of its kind, researchers found that having people pray for heart bypass surgery patients had no effect on their recovery. In fact, patients who knew they were being prayed for had a slightly higher rate of complications.
Posted 17 June 2011 - 11:11 PM
I wouldn't say it's statistically insignificant. I would say it says a lot about human psychology. I wish it had said more about what their patients had thought about through their recovery or lack there of (half the links to studies on that site are broken). Because they knew they were being prayed for, would they feel they could give up fighting physically? Or would it be the very thought that it would be okay if they died because they assumed they would be going to a better place afterwards. Hmm... At the same time praying personally has given positive results in some studies, the same as laughter and general optimism (the Patch Adams effect). I'm not sure what to make of that contradiction.It's been tested plenty of times.
I recall a particular study where the group that were being prayed for, but didn't know it, endured a lower rate of recovery than those that weren't, as well as those that were and knew it.
Statistically insignificant, but still an amusing result.
Posted 18 June 2011 - 02:48 AM
I mean, the observed effect was mathematically insignificant. Not as an interesting interpretation, but as a rigorously defined fact of the study.I wouldn't say it's statistically insignificant.
Ethics committees will be the death of us all.I would say it says a lot about human psychology. I wish it had said more about what their patients had thought about through their recovery or lack there of (half the links to studies on that site are broken). Because they knew they were being prayed for, would they feel they could give up fighting physically? Or would it be the very thought that it would be okay if they died because they assumed they would be going to a better place afterwards. Hmm... At the same time praying personally has given positive results in some studies, the same as laughter and general optimism (the Patch Adams effect). I'm not sure what to make of that contradiction.
The psychology of death has always fascinated me. It's too bad that they don't let people do all the good experiments anymore. They ruin it with their consent forms. /sigh
Posted 18 June 2011 - 02:54 AM
Ah, of course. Statistics are always dangerously interpreted as well to either bias. It's always much too easy to skew things to an ignorant public. I heard many, many rants on the subject from my stats professor.I mean, the observed effect was mathematically insignificant. Not as an interesting interpretation, but as a rigorously defined fact of the study.
Ethics committees will be the death of us all.
Posted 18 June 2011 - 02:01 PM
Posted 19 June 2011 - 10:11 AM
Thank you for basically reposting exactly what I said.
Posted 19 June 2011 - 10:29 AM
As I said above, I don't think it's being contested anywhere (in this topic anyways) that praying for someone without their knowledge of said prayer would benefit them. I do think that there is power in prayer for the person praying, namely, the placebo effect as mentioned above. The placebo effect is truly magnified when people are stretching the limitations of reality by allowing (in their minds) the possibility of supernatural occurrences in their lives. On the other side of that coin, yes, the power of prayer can be dangerous. Giving people a false sense of security and allowing their faith to overrule their common sense is definitely problematic... However when it comes to tragedies, death, famine, etc. I think prayer is definitely important for those who believe it works. When you're talking about prayer and politics... I think Karl Marx said it best with (translated obviously) "Religion is the opium of the people." (p.s. didn't mean to drop some Marx into a casual debate. )It's been tested plenty of times.
I recall a particular study where the group that were being prayed for, but didn't know it, endured a lower rate of recovery than those that weren't, as well as those that were and knew it.
Statistically insignificant, but still an amusing result.
Posted 19 June 2011 - 09:46 PM
Apparently this 16 year old Jehovah witness kid got cancer, and his parents wouldn't let him have surgery to remove it so he died by 17. Prayer is way too risky . It's like prayer is a form procrastination, no Mom, I don't wanna wake up yet, give me 5 more minutes!
Posted 27 June 2011 - 07:09 AM
Edited by IceSandwich, 27 June 2011 - 07:12 AM.
Posted 03 September 2011 - 09:42 PM
Posted 22 September 2011 - 08:33 PM
Posted 22 September 2011 - 10:17 PM
Posted 24 September 2011 - 03:46 PM
Thank you for basically reposting exactly what I said.
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