43 replies to this topic

[Nymh]

Chemistry's periodic table can now welcome livermorium and flerovium, two newly named elements, which were announced Thursday (Dec. 1) by the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry. The new names will undergo a five-month public comment period before the official paperwork gets processed and they show up on the table.

Three other new elements just recently finished this process, filling in the 110, 111 and 112 spots.

All five of these elements are so large and unstable they can be made only in the lab, and they fall apart into other elements very quickly. Not much is known about these elements, since they aren't stable enough to do experiments on and are not found in nature. They are called "super heavy," or Transuranium, elements.

Article on Live Science Here


This shit pisses me off. Let's smash a bunch of subatomic particles together and get them to stick for a few milliseconds, then call it a new element! Who cares that they are never going to be found in the real world and are so unstable that they will never have a practical application?

Please respond and be nerdy with me. Or make fun of me for being a nerd, whatever.

[Keil]

I'm totally with you. I really think they can better use that money for synthesizing new pharmaceutical compounds or cloning current endangered animals to make handheld pandas or lions. Instead, why not Take ALL THE SUBATOMIC PARTICLES AND PUSH THEM ALL TOGETHER!

I want to have faith in humanity by believing that they have practical applications in smashing subatomic particles in extreme conditions like the utilization of the radioactive decay from these "new elements" to produce something that a naturally producing element can't emit., but the cynic in me pictures them as overcompensating guidos trying to show off who has the biggest junk, tan, or muscle.

[Waser Lave]

Just because those new elements are pretty much useless with current technology doesn't mean they'll be useless forever.

[Sida]

Just because they're not stable doesn't mean they're not elements O.o

[nyquil]

I guess they are more excited at the thought of "what if..."
Like what if they got it to be stable and found it to be very practical in creating new better materials.

Other than that I'm with you, I don't find it amazing or exciting at all cause it doesn't change anything.

[Drakonid]

inb4 people start posting bullshit here to look smart.

[Sida]

inb4 people start posting bullshit here to look smart.

[Nymh]

How dare you crap on my topic!

[Junsu]

Well atoms are just subatomic particles smashed together LOL
Their application belongs where they are stable I guess

Edited by Junsu, 06 December 2011 - 01:57 PM.

[Jakerz]

Great a couple more things to memorize in chemistry class

[Nymh]

Well atoms are just subatomic particles smashed together LOL
Their application belongs where they are stable I guess

Well, yes, however in my opinion forcing a specified number of particles together and then slapping a label on the product before it falls apart does not constitute discovering anything new. For that matter we may as well pre-discover all of the elements. Since we can't study these five due to how unstable they are, that makes them no different from any other possible element we could dream up.

Edited by nymh, 06 December 2011 - 02:05 PM.

[Waser Lave]

Well atoms are just subatomic particles smashed together LOL

Are they?

[Nymh]

Are they?

Don't be such a quark.

[Waser Lave]

Don't be such a quark.

I like cheese.

[Nymh]

I like cheese.

That was an impressive association.

[Aarpm]

Is there theoretically an infinite amount of elements to be discovered?

That sucks.

[Sida]

Is there theoretically an infinite amount of elements to be discovered?

That sucks.

Nah.

[Hydrogen]

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Article on Live Science Here


This shit pisses me off. Let's smash a bunch of subatomic particles together and get them to stick for a few milliseconds, then call it a new element! Who cares that they are never going to be found in the real world and are so unstable that they will never have a practical application?

Please respond and be nerdy with me. Or make fun of me for being a nerd, whatever.

The breakthrough here is that scientists were able to overcome the strong force of the next largest element's nucleus and insert another proton inside. The strong force is aptly named -- it is the strongest force in the universe. It's not some tiny accomplishment and should definitely not be brushed off as just "smash a bunch of subatomic particles together and get them to stick for a few milliseconds, then call it a new element!"

[Bone]

We're also looking for planets with the potential of harboring life that are so far away that we won't be able to closely study or visit them for hundreds or thousands of years... It's the same situation: some dickhead (don't get angry at me fellow nerds, this is hyperbole) scientists are neglecting more important research so they can be first to synthesize some element, or discover extraterrestrial life, etc.



It's kind of like any internet comment box: instead of insightful observations, in the earlier stages all you get is "FIRST!!11".

[Waser Lave]

Is there theoretically an infinite amount of elements to be discovered?

That sucks.

Nobody knows for sure but I'd guess it's finite because there's only a certain amount of protons you can pump in until an atom becomes very unstable.

[Sida]

We're also looking for planets with the potential of harboring life that are so far away that we won't be able to closely study or visit them for hundreds or thousands of years

That may be true, but at least we'll know in which direction we need to direct our attempts at studying. And even if we can't study them, just finding a planet with good enough conditions to have a high chance at supporting life is enough for now. The best we have so far (I think) is that moon of water encased in ice, in the hope that there could be life trapped within the ice or under the surface.

[Nymh]

That may be true, but at least we'll know in which direction we need to direct our attempts at studying. And even if we can't study them, just finding a planet with good enough conditions to have a high chance at supporting life is enough for now. The best we have so far (I think) is that moon of water encased in ice, in the hope that there could be life trapped within the ice or under the surface.

In that respect, I guess these types of discoveries are useful. We can't really know where to develop if we don't know what direction we are headed in. I just wish the process were a little more mysterious and natural. To me it feels less like we are discovering the universe and more like we are creating it.

[Hydrogen]

In that respect, I guess these types of discoveries are useful. We can't really know where to develop if we don't know what direction we are headed in. I just wish the process were a little more mysterious and natural. To me it feels less like we are discovering the universe and more like we are creating it.

The more deeply you understand a subject matter, the less you can explain by just 'magic'

As my professor always used to say, "There's no man in the machine!"

[Waser Lave]

The more deeply you understand a subject matter, the less you can explain by just 'magic'

As my professor always used to say, "There's no man in the machine!"

The Wizard of Oz and The Turk disagree with your professor.

[iargue]

Just because those new elements are pretty much useless with current technology doesn't mean they'll be useless forever.

They are not a "new" element though.

They are just an alloy. They take a bunch of other elements, shove it together, and call it a new element. The fact that it quickly breaks down into a base element means that they are not true elements. They would be 100% stable on their own, rather then needing to be made in a lab, and lasting just a few seconds.

Eventually we will just have 10,000 elements and the chemistry final will be complete and utter hell.

Nobody knows for sure but I'd guess it's finite because there's only a certain amount of protons you can pump in until an atom becomes very unstable.

If this is any example, then there is an infinite number of elements. All we have to do is make it stick together for just a little while, and we can call it a new element. Eventually we will invent statis fields and just push a bunch of particles together and put a check on the clipboard and then push another one in.

In that respect, I guess these types of discoveries are useful. We can't really know where to develop if we don't know what direction we are headed in. I just wish the process were a little more mysterious and natural. To me it feels less like we are discovering the universe and more like we are creating it.

The best way to learn something, is to honestly build it, or take it apart (and put it back together).

When I first learned about computers, to understand cpu's and ram and all of that shit. I built a computer. It showed me each and every component, how they tie together, and what happens when something is missing. I know much more about how they work, because I built it, and make it work from scratch.

When I first learned how to program, I read a tutorial on it, and then built my own program. Actually typing out the structure, and seeing how its built step by step, showed me exactly what I needed to know to program in the future, and got me started right away on building bigger and more complicated programs.

Building new elements is awesome. But stop calling it an element until its actually a fucking element, not two elements stuck together by glue that's going to break any second. When an element can contain its electrons and neutrons, then it actually becomes an element. Until then, its a pile of neutrons and electrons.