79 replies to this topic

[Nymh]

I wonder if there are any Jews on the board to set us straight. I always thought that there were two completely separate things, the race and the religion. You don't convert into the race of course, and Jewish raced people could be another religion and still be considered a Jewish person (just of a different religion). Anyone else?

Dammit Sweeney, make one offhand comment about Jews and we rattle on for two pages about it.

[Senrath]

I don't know about on the board, but I do have a Jewish friend in Israel I can ask whenever he wakes up.

[Senrath]

Nah, I talk to him daily on Skype. Just have to wait for him to get on to ask him.

Edited by Senrath, 25 July 2012 - 07:51 PM.

[luvsmyncis]

Let me know when I can paint my petpet Jew.

[Waser Lave]

Race itself is really an antiquated (and, of course, completely socially constructed) concept but if we were currently living in the 19th century then Jewish people would definitely be considered as both a race and a religion. Obviously not all those of the Jewish religion would be of the Jewish race (and vice versa) but there is a valid case for it to be considered both of those things.

Either way, I'm off to make a Woody Allen Petpet.

[Nalah]

It's not really that racist though, just black.

And on the topic of Jews, considering they are a people group, thats kinda considered a race isn't it?

[Silver]

Interesting how there are so many views on what the term "race" consists of. Ignorantly, I had always beleieved everyone thought like me.

In my definition, race has everything to do with DNA similarities, and nothing to do with the thoughts of beliefe system that a given individual exhibits.

I feel it's contextual. One may speak of the human race to differenciate between humans and and all the other types of living organisms on the planet (indeed, extra-terrestrial as well).

Adversly, one may speak of races in terms of those within a subsect of humanity, such as those of a specific lineage, including but not limited to Anglo-saxon, African, Hispanic, Asian. I list these in terms of origin point rather than color of skin, since there are discrepencies within skin color groupings. For example, many on the island of Cape Verde (nearly all of which have a darker skin attribute) do not consider themselves among the African race. Much the same way some of Checloslovocian (can't be bothered to look up the spelling) descent do not consider themselves in the same racial grouping as the majority of other white folk.

One can speak of the arachnid (spider) race, as opposed to any other animal, even though there are many different types of arachnids species (take the black widow as compared to a daddy long legs).

All in all, I feel it's the DNA similarities/differences which designate one into one racial catigory or another; and not at all the thoughts one exhibits.


Side note; anyone remember the Dave Chapelle skit where he pretends to be blind, and dresses up like a Klansman? Thinking you are among one group doesn't make you one of that group.

[Senrath]

According to my friend, it's actually a bit more complex than I originally thought. While the ethnic group and the religion have strong ties to each other, you don't technically have to be in one to be in the other. And apparently you can be considered Jewish for the purposes of citizenship in Israel while being, say, Christian, but no one in the country will really consider you Jewish.

[Sweeney]

Interesting how there are so many views on what the term "race" consists of. Ignorantly, I had always beleieved everyone thought like me.

In my definition, race has everything to do with DNA similarities, and nothing to do with the thoughts of beliefe system that a given individual exhibits.

I feel it's contextual. One may speak of the human race to differenciate between humans and and all the other types of living organisms on the planet (indeed, extra-terrestrial as well).

Adversly, one may speak of races in terms of those within a subsect of humanity, such as those of a specific lineage, including but not limited to Anglo-saxon, African, Hispanic, Asian. I list these in terms of origin point rather than color of skin, since there are discrepencies within skin color groupings. For example, many on the island of Cape Verde (nearly all of which have a darker skin attribute) do not consider themselves among the African race. Much the same way some of Checloslovocian (can't be bothered to look up the spelling) descent do not consider themselves in the same racial grouping as the majority of other white folk.

One can speak of the arachnid (spider) race, as opposed to any other animal, even though there are many different types of arachnids species (take the black widow as compared to a daddy long legs).

All in all, I feel it's the DNA similarities/differences which designate one into one racial catigory or another; and not at all the thoughts one exhibits.


Side note; anyone remember the Dave Chapelle skit where he pretends to be blind, and dresses up like a Klansman? Thinking you are among one group doesn't make you one of that group.

You're commenting on an opinion that no one holds.

The Jewish race, and the Jewish religion are overlapping sets, they are not synonyms.

[Silver]

I suppose I should have added in that I don't feel that a religion has anything to do with race. In my mind, they're two seperate types of catagories. Also, I stated that it's simply my opinion, and aknowledged that fact that I'm aware not everyone feels the way I do. But since I hold that opinion, and I am a person, someone holds that opinion.

[Sweeney]

I suppose I should have added in that I don't feel that a religion has anything to do with race. In my mind, they're two seperate types of catagories. Also, I stated that it's simply my opinion, and aknowledged that fact that I'm aware not everyone feels the way I do. But since I hold that opinion, and I am a person, someone holds that opinion.

Holy shit. Can you not actually read?

[Romy]

Interesting how there are so many views on what the term "race" consists of. Ignorantly, I had always beleieved everyone thought like me.

In my definition, race has everything to do with DNA similarities, and nothing to do with the thoughts of beliefe system that a given individual exhibits.

All in all, I feel it's the DNA similarities/differences which designate one into one racial catigory or another; and not at all the thoughts one exhibits.

In the past, like today, all populations were genetically heterogeneous with larger degrees of variation within the groups than between them

For these reasons the fact that there are genetically differentiated populations does not necessarily validate the concept of race - since racial categorization of individuals is generally based on very broad criteria founded on arbitrary phenotypical characteristics such as skin color, which do not correlate well with geographic ancestry. For example, there is no logical reason that the typical American racial classification of people in groups of Black and White skin and Asian and Amerindian geographical ancestry is a better description of biological variation than other possible groupings of traits

The more you know. DNA is a pretty terrible indication of race.

Edit: Source http://en.wikipedia....ce_and_genetics

Edited by Ivysaur, 26 July 2012 - 01:25 PM.

[Keil]

Someone should make this argument in the Debate threads using.

I wish I had a Bat Boy petpet and be able to paint it black and name it Blackula.

[Silver]

Holy shit. Can you not actually read?

Maybe if you made your point clearer, I could give you a response you would find worth reading.

The more you know. DNA is a pretty terrible indication of race.

Edit: Source http://en.wikipedia....ce_and_genetics

I suppose this is a field I could bear to learn more about; it was my understanding that those trained could "read" the DNA and be able to tell you where your ancestors came from.

[wikkles]

I want Hanukkah painted pets in addition to Christmas painted pets...

They would have a blue and white color scheme, yarmulkes, fuzzy beards, and bigger noses

[Romy]

I suppose this is a field I could bear to learn more about; it was my understanding that those trained could "read" the DNA and be able to tell you where your ancestors came from.

That is true. My point was that the idea of "race" is a social construct created by colonizers to justify treating a group as inferior.

[Waser Lave]

That is true. My point was that the idea of "race" is a social construct created by colonizers to justify treating a group as inferior.

You could argue that pretty much anything is socially constructed.

[Romy]

You could argue that pretty much anything is socially constructed.

Social constructed with an extreme bias?

Quiet waser

[NapisaurusRex]

That is true. My point was that the idea of "race" is a social construct created by colonizers to justify treating a group as inferior.

Then why do people of the same race look alike?

[Romy]

YAA! Someone gets the truth. The concept of race is an artificial ego boundary construct. Week people want to be strong, they leech onto the external group for strength, therefore concepts like race and even colour get started.

Couldn't have said it better myself Coltom

Then why do people of the same race look alike?

Keep in mind that "race" was a term which referred mostly to a person's physical appearance. However, only .01% of your genes account for your appearance. The average genetic difference between one person and another is about... 0.04% to 0.05% thus leaving up to .04%of variation.

I can't be bothered to fix my horrid grammar and sentence structure. Meh. I think it's clear enough anyhow.

Edited by Ivysaur, 26 July 2012 - 08:33 PM.

[Henrymon]

Hah, I can't believe it when people make big deals out of something so small like this.

[Romy]

Hah, I can't believe it when people make big deals out of something so small like this.

It was a joke..?