41 replies to this topic

[8143FF763271]

A kid's doodles may be just as good as the sistine chapel.

Y'all heard me.

Discuss.

[Keil]

Good Taste does exist.

[Waser Lave]

A kid's doodles may be just as good as the sistine chapel.

That's not true, kid's drawings tend to be shit. I'm always disappointed with the work I did as a child as I look back now.

[8143FF763271]

That's not true, kid's drawings tend to be shit. I'm always disappointed with the work I did as a child as I look back now.

I think that your signature is ugly and tacky and I'd rather have a Raoul Dufy painting even though they look as if they were painted by a kid playing with water colors.



Who are you to determine that the latter is shit and the former isn't?

[Romy]

That is beauty.
I can say that 99% of the world's most famous artwork has followed that ratio.

People that repeatedly follow and recognize that ratio have great taste.

Edit: It's the golden ratio btw.
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Golden_ratio

Edited by Ivysaur, 14 August 2012 - 12:57 PM.

[Waser Lave]

What makes it any worse then people flinging paint at a canvas and selling it for thousands?

I didn't say they were any worse, the people willing to pay so much money for paint flung at a canvas have terrible taste too.

Who are you to determine that the latter is shit and the former isn't?

I am Waser Lave.

[Waser Lave]

But that's the point.
How do you know they have terrible taste?
Just because you don't like it, it's bad taste?
Maybe you just have bad taste and don't know it?

I am Waser Lave.

[8143FF763271]

That is beauty.
I can say that 99% of the world's most famous artwork has followed that ratio.

People that repeatedly follow and recognize that ratio have great taste.

Edit: It's the golden ratio btw.
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Golden_ratio

Sorry, but how does art follow this ratio?
And if I don't follow it, then why does that make my taste bad? What, because I don't subscribe to some "ratio" that most art just happens to follow, according to you, I do not have good taste? Who says? Who are you to determine that?

Where is the ratio?

The Sistine Chapel was an incredible expression of technique and skill. Centuries of talent went into everything from the paint to very scaffolding that was used, to the incredible engineering that made the backdrop. The perspective, the use of positive and negative space that takes a soul into the act of Creation, mere pictures are shit compared to the real thing, all that, with all that.,.,..

I call you a fool, for even bringing the point to discussion.

So? Maybe I prefer the simplicity of a child's drawing to all that work. What do I care about all that? Why should care about that? I simply do not find it beautiful. You can't tell me I'm wrong for not doing so.

[Waser Lave]

One thing I think we can all agree on, regardless of taste, is that this is a shit thread.

[Romy]

Sorry, but how does art follow this ratio?
And if I don't follow it, then why does that make my taste bad? What, because I don't subscribe to some "ratio" that most art just happens to follow, according to you, I do not have good taste? Who says? Who are you to determine that?

http://emptyeasel.co...an-for-artists/


Look it up. The painting you presented, though chaotic, has a flow and proportion to it.
The golden ratio does NOT designate one form of art from another nor does it value one medium above another
It is merely a method of space distribution that humans are more likely to find aesthetically pleasing.

We are all naturally tuned to find this proportion beautiful.
People who are unable to naturally identify this proportion have bad taste.

Edited by Ivysaur, 14 August 2012 - 01:37 PM.

[8143FF763271]

http://emptyeasel.co...an-for-artists/


Look it up. The painting you presented, though chaotic, has a flow and proportion to it.
The golden ratio does NOT designate one form of art from another nor does it value one medium above another
It is merely a method of space distribution that humans are more likely to find aesthetically pleasing.

We are all naturally tuned to find this proportion beautiful.
People who are unable to naturally identify this proportion have bad taste.

What you're basically saying is that if our taste isn't like everyone else's we have bad taste. Why is our taste bad for being different? How the fuck is that "bad"? What makes it bad? Your preposition (that people tend to like something) isn't connected to your conclusion (that their taste is bad if they don't). People tend to like Justin Bieber songs... is my taste bad for not liking them?

Also, I want you to concretely point out the golden ration in the painting I showed you lol. Telling me vaguely that it has "flow" and "proportion" to it does not mean it follows a particular ratio. From someone that has studied art history at depth, I can tell you that the golden ratio as both aesthetic canon and aesthetic ideal is a load of horse shit. There have been other "proportional" canons, mainly in the medium of statues and regarding body proportions, and these too have been subject to change. Do people tend to find harmony in symmetry? Sure, but not all symmetry is beautiful and not all beauty is symmetrical.

Edited by kami12, 14 August 2012 - 02:10 PM.

[8143FF763271]

Of course I can, I'm an engineer. You're bloody wrong, you were bloody wrong the moment you started this nonsense, you think its some how mind expanding, but that's because you've not developed you mind the the degree that is required to understand how meaningless you context free abstraction is to the world.

All meaning is self-defined. Engineers don't dictate aesthetic canons... or any important cultural convention.

So I still definitely don't see how it constitutes bad taste or good taste. I see someone with a sensibility for... uh... engineering getting his panties in a knot because I like children's paintings better than the sistine chapel.

[Nymh]

The fact that something is subjective does not mean that it doesn't exist.

[8143FF763271]

The fact that something is subjective does not mean that it doesn't exist.

No, but the fact that something is subjective means that it cannot be used as an objective criterion.

Edited by kami12, 14 August 2012 - 02:16 PM.

[8143FF763271]

Oh child, you think you can look upon all of the works of your betters, and just by your great importance decide that all the skill, talent and ability are meaningless, you'd rather bang a couple of pots together than hear Bach.

Meaningless tripe, heard it all before from foolish people 30 years ago, and you somehow think you're clever with the same silliness.

You heard it from foolish people 30 years ago? Interesting. I wonder what sage taught you that telling someone you've heard an argument before constitutes a rebuttal!

[Waser Lave]

No, but the fact that something is subjective means that it cannot be used as an objective criterion.

What is the point of this thread then? It's equivalent to creating a debate thread about the existence (or not) of god and following every point with "but you can't prove that something doesn't exist".

[Sweeney]

No, but the fact that something is subjective means that it cannot be used as an objective criterion.

Can you show me where anyone has ever used "good taste" as an objective criterion?

[8143FF763271]

What is the point of this thread then? It's equivalent to creating a debate thread about the existence (or not) of god and following every point with "but you can't prove that something doesn't exist".

Aesthetic canons tend to exist and be culturally imposed on people. To me, it's a fact that there's no good taste. All value in art is subjectively defined. I might enjoy watching pokemon cartoons because it produces a certain nostalgia. Why should I be looked down upon for it? Pokemon has a higher value to me as a subject because of how I identify with its content. That it doesn't have that value to you as another subject is irrelevant.

Yet, we often get told that we have "bad" taste, that this and this is poor art, that this music "sucks", etc. I am making people question the underlying assumption behind such claims: Who is telling you that art is bad or good and why should their opinion trump yours? Under what criterion? Why is it valid? How is it valid? What anyone finds beautiful is just as valid as what anyone else finds beautiful.

[Nymh]

Have you been smoking today?