478 replies to this topic

[Waser Lave]

You've just been very lucky.

 

Or very unlucky and they just don't work and I don't know about it yet!

[luvsmyncis]

Or very unlucky and they just don't work and I don't know about it yet!

 

Hey! Same here. Wouldn't that be something? Thinking we've been so careful, then one day the doctor tells you YOU'RE BARREN. *gasp*

[Waser Lave]

Hey! Same here. Wouldn't that be something? Thinking we've been so careful, then one day the doctor tells you YOU'RE BARREN. *gasp*

 

Do you reckon checking to make sure you're not barren is a valid reason for abortion?

[luvsmyncis]

Do you reckon checking to make sure you're not barren is a valid reason for abortion?

 

I can't think of any other way to find out.

To be double dog sure, I'd better check using multiple partner. Just in case my boyfriend is shooting blanks.

[Tetiel]

Let me clarify something since quite a few of you guys didn't think Joe's post was clear. It was perfectly clear to me, but I read wikipedia articles for fun, yo.

If the risks of carrying the baby to full term outweigh the risks of an abortion, the ethical response is to allow the woman to have an abortion if she wants one. However, I would like to talk about the risks of abortion. Conception up to 9 weeks (by the way - weeks are counted from the date of the woman's last period, not 8 weeks since conception or implantation) is very, very safe. There are two options generally available - the abortion pill which induces miscarriage or a surgical aspiration. Both pose little risk to the mother.

Once the fetus is about 9-12 weeks, the uterus has created more of a blood-enriched lining which causes more bleeding when the abortion is performed. At this point, the abortion pill is somewhat ineffective and aspiration or D&C are considered. Second trimester and above, only D&Es (evacuation vs cutterage) are considered. This is a much more traumatic procedure and the risks increase significantly. It is, however, still safer than birth for some women. At this point general anesthesia is often used (dear god, can you imagine your inner lining of one of your organs being cut out by a scalpel NOT under general???) and that poses its own risks. Third trimester abortions are significantly more dangerous than birth itself - therefore without proper reasoning, it is unethical to do with few a exceptions.

There are circumstances that could happen which make a third term abortion acceptable. Preeclampsia, a newly discovered birth defect, maternal illness such as cancer which would prevent her from carrying to full term... I know that if I were told that I had a choice between an abortion/induced labor of a stillborn child vs carrying it to full term or miscarrying it myself, I'd take the abortion even if it were more risky just because the mental trauma would be worse.  But the whole thing is, accessing risk is entirely between the patient and the doctor and I'll be damned if it's anyone else's business. People need to learn to shut the fuck up about things they don't understand and cannot even fully comprehend because they have never, ever been in a similar situation. And that includes my 15 year old self.

[MoonMoon]

I'm pro-choice. I think women deserve the right to do what they want with their body, especially if it's something as life-changing as pregnancy. I know someone who is my best friend who was brought up under the government's care. His life was utter shit because he was born, and no one deserves to be born into a life where their mother can't even take care of them. HOWEVER, I am glad that he's alive, because if she aborted, he would not be here today. I guess it's just a case-by-case basis for me, but I am pro-choice. Whatever you do with your body has nothing to do with me, so I don't really care.

[Murse]

There's so much to read here!

Personally I don't believe anyone not involved in the situation has a say. 

I'm pro-choice. If someone down the road from me wants an abortion, even if I don't agree with it, why the hell should I care? It's not going to affect me. We have enough people on this earth, and a lot of people are unwanted and uncared for. 

I know someone that works at a clinic where they do abortions. It's a very difficult decision, not for the weak. If you get to that point, you clearly know what you're doing and willing to take the risks. 
 

[evoheyax]

I don't care what happens, If a women gets pregnant and wants to abort, its her choice. Now, I do think people overly abort these days, but mistakes happen...

[DonValentino]

 

lmao my cousin just sent me this

[Girly]

The results of this poll really don't surprise me. I feel as my generation (I born in 1993) are more liberal when it comes to access to contraceptives. We have too many kids in the system already who can't get a hand up, which is why I cast my vote for pro-choice. Also, a woman should be able to get a medical operation, granted it is HER body.

[Batori]

Absolutely pro-choice. You do what you want with your body, and I'll do what I want with mine. Funny story: a friend of mine recently got pregnant accidentally, and was feeling overwhelmed. We'd talked about abortion before, and she said while she was pro-choice, it wasn't something she wanted to do personally. Which is totally fine. So when she told me she was preggo, she was kinda freaking out--until I told her I'd support her in any choice she made, even if she decided that it wasn't the right time for a baby.

 

And the thing is, she relaxed a ton. I don't think she ever seriously considered aborting, but I think knowing she had the option helped.

[seraph]

Existential nihilist so pro anything that keeps people from being born. Being pro-life seems incredibly naive to me (unless you're religious in which case you're free to believe whatever you want). There is no rational non-religious way to prove life has any objective value or meaning, creating another meaningless existence seems rather cruel to me. You can't ask the child whether or not they want to exist before they're born and once they're here they're stuck in a world that offers fleeting moments of pleasure but is ultimately full of suffering if you actually look at the whole thing and have empathy. The only way out is to suffer a death which isn't all that pleasant. 

 

Not to mention that this is how I feel about someone (like myself) who was born in a loving family, most lives being 'saved' from abortion would have no such privilege. I can't imagine the psychological torment of having no family, no home, no 'constants' to rely on in your developing years or the only people you have as a child seeing you as a mistake and possibly making their opinion clear in a physical way on a regular basis.

Edited by seraph, 02 October 2014 - 10:49 AM.

[Adam]

 

I made it through less than 5 minutes of this. How disgusting.

[kianakins]

I use to believe in pro-life until the people that I knew became pregnant and didn't want a child at the time. I realized that it's hard to really say what you want until you've been through it yourself so I can't imagine what they felt being pro-life but not wanting it. Pro-choice for me.

[Turnip]

 
I made it through less than 5 minutes of this. How disgusting.

Because creating new medicines is totally not important, right? I don't know much about it, but this helps with stem cell research and that sounds pretty important as well.

[Adam]

Because creating new medicines is totally not important, right? I don't know much about it, but this helps with stem cell research and that sounds pretty important as well.

Are you sure these body parts are going for research? Did you watch the whole video, and notice the captions about illegal sale of body parts? How do you know that there aren't just sick fucks buying these 'goods' for disgusting purposes? PP big-wigs are making a LOT of money off of aborted fetuses, seems legit to me.

[Sweeney]

Are you sure these body parts are going for research? Did you watch the whole video, and notice the captions about illegal sale of body parts? How do you know that there aren't just sick fucks buying these 'goods' for disgusting purposes? PP big-wigs are making a LOT of money off of aborted fetuses, seems legit to me.

You actually fell for that remarkably obvious propaganda video? Incredible.

[Bear]

Pro-choice for sure. YOu have complete control over your body and the will to exert, fudge what anybody else thinks.

[Kway]

Fun Fact: Female polar bears have the ability to terminate their pregnancy if they won't be able to support the cubs.

 

Imagine how many problems would be solved if humans had this awesome ability.

[stagsong]

The problem with splitting it into pro-life/pro-choice is that it leaves out the gray stances in the middle. The whole dichotomy is broken, and doesn't take into account as a few people have mentioned, after birth care or choices given. Definitely something I don't miss from the US.  

 

Here in Australia everyone is entitled to money to take care of their child if they meet income requirements, and they're pretty fair. My husband and I will be receiving money once our child comes because I won't be working, even though he is, for example.

 

Women should be entitled to safe and legal abortion choices as needed, and that need can only be determined by them. No governing body or person can tell someone else what is absolutely right for them, and I certainly wouldn't. Having said that, I am also supportive of helping people who want to have the baby and give it up for adoption, or need some help. Life is precious and shouldn't be taken lightly, and it can be psychologically damaging to have an abortion. 

 

If someone wants an abortion, absolutely they should have access. But I think they should also have easy access to information before that is scientific and not pushy to give them facts about ALL of their choices, they should be given free therapy if they want to talk to a non-involved third party, and should be given access to care if they decide to carry to term. They shouldn't feel pressured either way.

[Required]

Pro-choice, definitely. Everyone should have the option to do whatever he or she wants.

I personally think that the whole world is moving towards an individualistic way of living and the change is strongly attached to these concepts. I'm not going to enter a never ending discussion about whether or not individualism is what society should persue, but it is certainly what the future is moving towards. The change should always be supported with higher education accessible to everyone. Utopia, maybe, but ideal.

[Kaddict]

How does everyone feel about gender specific abortions (ie. most abortions in India/China happen because they dont want to have a girl)

[Coops]

How does everyone feel about gender specific abortions (ie. most abortions in India/China happen because they dont want to have a girl)

@Kaddict I disagree with abortion based on a cultural idea about a gender which is steeped in patriarchal misogyny. I am certain the numbers of abortions in those regions are high and that many women feel pressured to abort, or are coerced to do so. This is a highly unethical practice and their regions are beginning to feel a shortage of available females in the marrying age range. This is one reason why patriarchal systems which denigrate women must be stopped. I advocate as pro-choice 100% of the time - the key word being choice. If a woman is being pressured to abort because her family and society tells her females are worthless and a burden, I do not support abortion. That is not choice. That is manipulation and terrorism, in my opinion. It is so disgusting to make one feel as if the life inside of them is lesser because of the sex. Not only that, but that woman will begin to doubt her own value and internalize these messages her family and society is sending.

[devem]

I'd like to say I'm indifferent. Morally, and for myself, I would say pro-life. However, I do not feel it is my right to say someone else cannot do something to themselves. Therefore, ethically, I am inclined to say pro-choice. 

 

As I mentioned, though, morally I never would abort. I feel as I am responsible for making this thing, and I do see it as a living being, so I should at least give it the chance to live. Perhaps not with me, but a life nonetheless.

 

[Romy]

I'd like to say I'm indifferent. Morally, and for myself, I would say pro-life. However, I do not feel it is my right to say someone else cannot do something to themselves. Therefore, ethically, I am inclined to say pro-choice. 

 

As I mentioned, though, morally I never would abort. I feel as I am responsible for making this thing, and I do see it as a living being, so I should at least give it the chance to live. Perhaps not with me, but a life nonetheless.

 

What if you were raped?